Talk:Michael Jordan/Archive 5

 Done

Due to a dispute about a literal-minded interpretation of the guideline for disambiguation pages, can this page include an explicit mention of the initials "MJ" as a commonly used shorthand for refering to Jordan? I'm not sure about where to place this information in such a high-profile article like this. While I argue this is simple common sense and that WP:IAR should apply on the dab page, another editor disagrees and insists that there needs to be an explicit reference on this page in order to include Jordan on the MJ dab page. There are many references to "MJ" in the headline of blogs associated with quality news organizations, and also likely many to be found in actual news articles, though those need more careful parsing as "MJ" is less likely to appear in the headline. A few possible sources: "MJ scores with new steakhouse", Chicago Tribune; "Maya Moore talks WNBA playoffs", Toronto Sun Quote: the best basketball player in the world -- MJ himself. Yes, Michael Jordan; [http://www.wcnc.com/news/local/Bobcats-owner-Jordan-still-cashing-in-130568103.html "Michael Jordan makes $60 million in endorsements", WCNC.com., Quote: MJ is still one of the most well-liked athletes in the world. older ≠ wiser 13:47, 7 October 2011 (UTC)

Sure. Add to the lead perhaps?—Chris!_c/t 17:20, 7 October 2011 (UTC)

That's typically where such things go, though it just seems a little stupid to me to have to state something that's so obvious. Another possibility might be to introduce it at a later point, something like Jordan (known as "MJ" to fans and sports headline writers), etc.. older ≠ wiser 17:35, 7 October 2011 (UTC)

I think this source is most explicit about MJ being a nickname. But I agree that it'll be awkward to add it here.. "Air Jordan" is at least discussed in context. Zagalejo^^^ 18:00, 7 October 2011 (UTC)

I propose resolving this issue by adding the following sentence to the end of the lead section:

Jordan is sometimes referred to simply by his initials MJ.^[3]

Does anyone have any objections? (Disclosure: I am "other editor" mentioned in the original post, who asserts that "MJ" should be mentioned explicitly on this page if Jordan is to be included on the MJ DAB page.) Mitch Ames (talk) 13:14, 15 October 2011 (UTC)

I won't fight it. It does seem like a weird thing to end the lead with. We'd probably need to restructure parts of the lead to make a better fit. But I guess it's good enough for right now. Zagalejo^^^ 22:17, 15 October 2011 (UTC)

I did consider adding appending it to the sentence that mentions his nicknames "Air Jordan" and "His Airness", but that sentence is about his "leaping ability", not his nickname(s), so adding MJ there would look even sillier than adding a sentence to the end of the lead. Mitch Ames (talk) 23:36, 15 October 2011 (UTC)

Yeah, I agree that it wouldn't make sense there. Zagalejo^^^ 05:28, 16 October 2011 (UTC)

Done. Mitch Ames (talk) 13:07, 19 October 2011 (UTC)

Why doesn't the article say anything about his 98-99 season? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 166.82.187.246 (talk) 22:27, 11 November 2011 (UTC)

He had retired before the season began. Zagalejo^^^ 01:04, 12 November 2011 (UTC)

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 (Update Info below)

He is a member of Omega Psi Phi Fraternity.

75.246.94.104 (talk) 06:25, 11 January 2012 (UTC)

Not done: please provide reliable sources that support the change you want to be made. — Bility (talk) 22:49, 11 January 2012 (UTC)

Just wondering, but I went to Michael Jordan's biography on NBA.com, and no-where there does it say "By acclamation, Michael Jordan is the greatest basketball player of all time."
(Sorry if I got the quote wrong, but hopefully you guys got the idea). Should this statement be removed?
-Izo, 02/03/2012 (UTC) — Preceding unsigned comment added by 68.32.36.42 (talk)

Did you check the right link? It's the first sentence here, in bold. Zagalejo^^^ 03:49, 3 February 2012 (UTC)

Oh I see. Here's another bio of MJ on nba.com: here. My bad. -Izo, 02/05/2012 (UTC) — Preceding unsigned comment added by 68.32.36.42 (talk)

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He is a member of Omega Psi Phi Fraternity.

75.216.248.107 (talk) 02:06, 7 February 2012 (UTC)

 Not done, source?--Jac16888 ^Talk 11:11, 7 February 2012 (UTC)

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I would like to change a few facts on the micheal jordan page

Howardboy1 (talk) 17:29, 22 February 2012 (UTC)

Not done: please be more specific about what needs to be changed.—Bagumba (talk) 18:41, 22 February 2012 (UTC)

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LeBron James just wont the Defensive Play of the Year award, as well as the MVP award. The article mentions that Jordan won both awards, and lists the players having accomplished the same feat, yet fails to include James. The article further notes that Jordan received both awards in the same year, again without mentioning that James equaled him in this regard.

Hubbah (talk) 15:17, 14 May 2012 (UTC)

James did not win the defensive player of the year award. Tyson Chandler did. Zagalejo^^^ 23:28, 14 May 2012 (UTC)

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No. 23, 45, 12, 9 65.95.218.187 (talk) 18:38, 29 September 2012 (UTC) No. 23, 45, 12, 9

Partly done:Added #12 since he wore that with the Bulls, did not add #9 as that was his Olympic number, which are not added to infoboxes Rikster2 (talk) 19:33, 29 September 2012 (UTC)

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Numbers : 23, 45 65.95.218.187 (talk) 18:39, 29 September 2012 (UTC) Number: 23, 45, 12, 9

Not done: Duplicate of previous request.—Bagumba (talk) 05:46, 30 September 2012 (UTC)

Re: statement "[Michael Jordan] was instrumental in popularizing the NBA around the world in the 1980s and 1990s". Please review Wiki policy and just state the facts. There also seem to be many other instances in this article. --Coolbb (talk) 19:39, 31 December 2011 (UTC)

That specific example is not puffery. There are plenty of sources that discuss his role in popularizing the NBA (see this and this, for a couple of examples.) Zagalejo^^^ 21:59, 1 January 2012 (UTC)

If you want to reword things, feel free, but I don't think that specific statement is egregiously bad. Zagalejo^^^ 23:23, 1 January 2012 (UTC)

So what popularised the nba, if not players? Chensiyuan (talk) 04:08, 14 January 2012 (UTC)

Is it clearly a fact that Michael Jordan was instrumental in popularizing the NBA? Is it an opinion, but not clearly a fact? If the latter is the case, then shouldn't it be made clear that the sources consider such to be the case, rather than such necessarily actually being the case? Or is it sufficient to phrase opinions in a factual manner on Wikipedia as long as the opinions are sourced? --Coolbb (talk) 14:53, 14 January 2012 (UTC)

I think its a fact but it needs backed up by sources. I know it was a fact that Michael Jordan was instrumental in popularizing the NBA, for me. I watched the NBA because of Jordan. It is also a fact that WGN-TV and WGN America which brought almost all Chicago Bulls and Michael Jordan's games to many homes via cable tv it also was instrumental in popularizing the NBA. This meant that almost every one in the USA could watch every game from like 1989 to 1993 Jordan and the Bulls played at or near their home. 1989 and 1990 they reached the Eastern Conf. Finals losing to Detroit then 1991-1993 was the Bulls 1st 3peat. Theworm777 (talk) 00:10, 6 March 2012 (UTC)

There's no doubt Jordan helped to inspire and popularize the NBA I think, but he didn't save the NBA. That was Magic and Bird. I think maybe changing it to say he was instrumental in inspiring fans- but he might not have gotten ratings higher. Any sources for NBA TV ratings from the mid-late eighties to the nineties? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 72.74.175.36 (talk) 21:35, 18 November 2012 (UTC)

Michael Jordan didnt popularize or save basketball, as this one sided article suggests. 72.74.175.36 (talk) 20:29, 1 November 2012 (UTC)

It's seems reasonably supported by the source. If you have reliable counterpoints, they can be added for neutrality.—Bagumba (talk) 20:46, 1 November 2012 (UTC)

Jordan was a great player, but he didnt save the sport. Basketball's popularity was down in the 80's, Bird and Magic saved it, and Jordan maintained that popularity. I am not saying Jordan didnt help make basketball like it is today, i am just saying that he didnt save the sport. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 72.74.175.36 (talk) 00:17, 18 November 2012 (UTC)

Does the article say he "saved" basketball? Zagalejo^^^ 01:48, 18 November 2012 (UTC)

Checking...checking...oops. No. Sorry, I was thinking of a recent book I read. Forgive me. 72.74.175.36 (talk) 21:37, 18 November 2012 (UTC)

Could someone put in a sentence about Jordan being in charge of basketball operations for the Bobcats when they had their record losing season? Honestly, this article is biased 72.74.175.36 (talk) 00:29, 18 November 2012 (UTC)

That seems fair to mention. I've added a bit. Zagalejo^^^ 01:47, 18 November 2012 (UTC)

Coincidentally, Jordan was a part of the team with the highest and lowest winning percentages in NBA history, during the year of their record-setting percentage — Preceding unsigned comment added by 72.74.175.36 (talk) 15:50, 25 November 2012 (UTC)

I have removed the huge amount of template spam that we see here - we have limits Wikipedia:Template limits - pls think of our readers before adding 44 templates to a page. Just crazy. Perhaps split them up - add awards to the actual awards pages etc.... Plus we need Wikipedia:WikiProject Baseball to get there act together and fix there templates to follow our basic policies on accessibilityMoxy (talk) 19:08, 24 February 2013 (UTC)

You don't seem to understand what spam means in Wikipedia, please see WP:SPAM. WP:Navigation templates allow readers to navigate between articles. I am aware of Wikipedia:Template limits, but this article hasn't reach the limit yet, so why should we worry about that. Just because you dislike them, doesn't mean you could remove without discussion.—Chris!_c/t 20:54, 24 February 2013 (UTC)

44 templates is spam in the literal meaning without dough (commons sense). Would be best to have things like award templates in the article that is actually about awards and achievements - this would be logical. But if this is the norm in these type of article - as with the templates that need to be fixed for accessibility - not much I can say I guess to change things - back to history and genetics for me. I have reverted the removal of the mass of templates. Moxy (talk) 21:23, 24 February 2013 (UTC)

How can readers navigate from this page to other articles if these navigation templates are placed in the awards and achievements article? That is the problem of your suggestion.—Chris!_c/t 21:29, 24 February 2013 (UTC)

There is an article about "awards and achievements" that is linked along with all the main awards from this page already. Secondly the templates are about his awards and achievements thus should be in the related article. I have looked at other articles and see this is a problem all over Bball articles (dont normally edit sports articles). Lets look at another pop culture type article that is FA level that had this problem a few years ago like The Beatles - note how the templates are directly related to the subject. I simply dont see how templates linking hundreds and hundreds of name including ones like Tom Seaver - Wayne Gretzky - Lance Armstrong are helpful. But like I said if its the norm here O well.Moxy (talk) 21:52, 24 February 2013 (UTC) Moxy (talk) 21:52, 24 February 2013 (UTC)

We could probably do with a little bit of navbox housekeeping. The Miami Heat navbox is a bit of a stretch; I think the only reason that one is included is because the Heat retired (or honored) Jordan's jersey number. The magazine awards are often redundant to the NBA's own awards, so the navboxes don't really add much. Zagalejo^^^ 21:54, 24 February 2013 (UTC)

That "Template Limits" article should be re-written in English since this is English Wikipedia. I can't tell that it says much of anything. Templates aren't spam, but I agree with Zagalejo that templates like the Miami Heat shouldn't include MJ anyway. Rikster2 (talk) 22:11, 24 February 2013 (UTC)

I am open to some housekeeping to remove unnecessary navboxes.—Chris!_c/t 22:14, 24 February 2013 (UTC)

I've seen ad hoc nomaination deletions at WP:TFD, but it would help if we had general understanding within WP:NBA of what we are trying to achieve with nav templates, and when they should be used be used and when a wikilink to the top level article is sufficient. WP:NAVBOX says, "The articles should refer to each other, to a reasonable extent." For this reason, NBA championship rosters are OK, and definitely a high and rare achievement. I always wondered about {{1984 NBA Draft}} and the like. Do we really need to navigate through the whole draft? {{NBA minutes leaders}} seems downright trivial. I can see how a navbox of related topics is helpful like {{NBA Awards}}. I'm beginning to wonder about navboxes that merely enumerate lists of winners of award or honors, when the award/honor is already linked in the prose.—Bagumba (talk) 22:29, 24 February 2013 (UTC)

What do you think the odds are WP:Bball would fix there templates to comply with our basic accessibility policies like WP:NAVBOXCOLOUR = navboxes whose colors conflict with each other, background colors should contrast the text color enough to make the template easily readable.....and WP:COLOR = Links should clearly be identifiable as a link to our readers? Moxy (talk) 00:08, 25 February 2013 (UTC)

I would support it, though it's not my area of expertise/interest to work on coloring. There was a discussion a week ago for colors used for one team—an unreadable red text on black background; it was changed to white text. The current color scheme reuses colors used by the respective teams in real life; not sure if accessibility was taken into consideration.—Bagumba (talk) 06:38, 25 February 2013 (UTC)

I see by that talk the project is not aware of our basic policies on the matter. Never hide links just to have nice colors(Help:link color) - will write a small proposal that explains our accessibility polices - and then see what happens.Moxy (talk) 20:17, 26 February 2013 (UTC)

Sounds good. Might be best if you place your proposal at WT:NBA.—Bagumba (talk) 21:16, 26 February 2013 (UTC)

He played over 3000 games in his live/career — Preceding unsigned comment added by 24.36.224.59 (talk) 22:01, 18 March 2013 (UTC)

I don't see where the 3,000 figure comes from. Even if you combine his pro and college careers, and include playoff and NCAA Tournament games, he doesn't come close to 3,000 games played, and I don't think the most experienced veteran would either. Giants2008 (Talk) 16:08, 24 March 2013 (UTC)

It would take a average of 100 games a year for 30 years to play 3000 games. He would still be playing this season to play 30 years in the NBA. Jordan has played 15 years and 1231 games (with play-offs) in the NBA. In his 3 years of college he played 101 games and in high school he was JV his sophomore year so at max he played 160 games in high school if he even played on a freshman team. If he played in youth leauges, counted pre-season, national team (Olympics) and exhibition games he would still be under 2000 games. Theworm777 (talk) 07:50, 25 March 2013 (UTC)

Page currently reads: "A Nike commercial shown during the 1993 Super Bowl XXVII featured Jordan and Bugs Bunny playing basketball against a group of Martian characters." This is incorrect; the ad features Bugs and Michael playing against four humans. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 50.34.245.155 (talk) 00:15, 17 December 2013 (UTC)

The reference didn't give that level of detail about the commercial, so that probably shouldn't have been included to begin with. That wasn't even the worst issue: the ad aired before the 1992 Super Bowl, not in 1993 (the Jordan–Larry Bird HORSE commerical aired then). Thanks for bringing this up; I've made corrections accordingly, although the sources I've found don't go into detail about who Jordan and Bugs were playing against. That can be added if a good source is found. Giants2008 (Talk) 21:15, 18 December 2013 (UTC)

This is a small detail, but currently, in the infobox at the top of the page, it lists Jordan's "Pro playing career" as 1984-2003. Shouldn't it really read "1984-1993, 1995-1998, 2001-2003." I know it makes the listing longer, but it really is more accurate: Jordan was not a pro in 1994, 1999, or 2000. I guess another way to do it would be "Pro playing career: 1984-2003 (inactive 1994, 1999-2000)" — Preceding unsigned comment added by 137.169.21.1 (talk) 19:55, 25 February 2014 (UTC)

I agree with you that it would be more accurate, but the infobox parameters make it hard to list the years in that way. The parameters are "career start" and "career end", which doesn't take into account the possibility of players like Jordan who retire and then return after a period away from basketball. The current listing appears to be the best that is possible under the circumstances. Giants2008 (Talk) 20:07, 3 March 2014 (UTC)

"Jordan was known throughout his career for being a strong clutch performer. He decided numerous games with last-second plays (e.g., The Shot) and performed at a high level even under adverse circumstances (e.g., Flu Game)"

This is one unsourced statement that always made me scratch my head. Call me crazy, but I can't think of any other game in Jordan's career where he faced "adverse conditions" like in the Flu Game. Not that that's a bad thing - one of the truly extraordinary aspects of Jordan's career was his durability. Aside from his second season in the league, Jordan never missed more than 4 games in a season with the Bulls. He never had to play through ankle sprains, pulled groins, achy knees, bone spurs in his shooting elbow, etc. The one season where he did get hurt, he did exactly what you would expect from a player going through an injury: relatively poor performance when playing hurt, mediocre performance upon his return, and then steady improvement over the following month until he was back at full strength.

I can't find a reliable source that discusses Jordan's durability. If someone else can, I would suggest adding a sentence about that. But the "adverse circumstances" line should be removed unless it can be sourced--and, preferably, supported by a couple more examples and/or a clarification of what "adverse circumstances" means. Niremetal (talk) 02:29, 17 April 2014 (UTC)

Those are both valid points. I removed the adverse circumstances bit and added a stat on his game-winning shots with the Bulls. There was at least one he had with the Wizards, but I can't find a source that ties it to the Bulls game-winners, so I left it out for now. Also, I found a New York Times article that cited the stat you mentioned, so I added a sentence on his durability as you suggested. Giants2008 (Talk) 19:43, 18 April 2014 (UTC)

Certainly adverse circumstances would imply sickness or injury. I suppose you think he played 82 games on nine different occasions without any injury or illness? There are known instances when he played through both though documentation would probably prove much more difficult to compile.Hoops gza (talk) 20:14, 18 April 2014 (UTC)

Can someone fix the amount of templates at the bottom of the page? I am getting an error that leaves them all expanded making the page HUGE. Is it normal to have so many repeating the same info? -- 67.193.80.240 (talk) 22:02, 18 April 2014 (UTC)

Article has him as second in all time steals behind John Stockton. Jason Kidd passed him last year — Preceding unsigned comment added by 24.49.104.44 (talk) 02:52, 1 January 2013 (UTC)

Fixed, thanks! Zagalejo^^^ 04:21, 1 January 2013 (UTC)

Article says that he is the 2nd best NBA player of all-time after Jarvis Varnado???? It looks like a fan is promoting Mr. Varnado. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Penthrift (talk • contribs) 08:56, 13 July 2014 (UTC)

That bit of vandalism was removed. Giants2008 (Talk) 17:02, 18 July 2014 (UTC)

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please change Regular Season stats from:

1985–86 Chicago 18 7 25.1 .457 .351 .167 3.6 2.9 2.1 1.2 22.7

to

1985–86 Chicago 18 7 25.1 .457 .167 .840 3.6 2.9 2.1 1.2 22.7

Source is http://www.nba.com/history/players/jordan_stats.html Mikkoathome (talk) 17:27, 5 August 2014 (UTC) Mikkoathome

 Done The existing Basketball-Reference citation confirmed that there had been errors in those two categories for 1985–86, so I made the change. Thanks for bringing that up! Giants2008 (Talk) 02:16, 7 August 2014 (UTC)

Under section 8, NBA career statistics, three columns in both tables - FG%, 3P%, FT% - need to have their values multiplied by 100 to give the percentage (%) as listed by the column header. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Cgos62703 (talk • contribs) 10:03, 17 December 2014 (UTC)

I checked several other articles on prominent current and former NBA players, and in each of them the values are given as decimals for those columns. That leads me to believe that this is a style choice made by the NBA WikiProject, and I don't like interfering with WikiProject preferences unless there is a really good reason for doing so. They probably have a good rationale for the formatting, which doesn't bother me enough to want to change it myself. Giants2008 (Talk) 22:06, 22 December 2014 (UTC)

I think it's mostly consistent with sources covering the NBA (probably college basketball too). Might not make mathematical sense, but it is following convention.—Bagumba (talk) 23:18, 22 December 2014 (UTC)

I recall seeing footage from his college years going by the name Mike Jordan. Could anyone confirm this? - Bossanoven (talk) 00:00, 28 January 2015 (UTC)

U.S. basketball legend Michael Jordan, whose name in Chinese is transliterated as Qiaodan, is suing Qiaodan Sports Co. for misleading consumers by using his name and his jersey number, 23, as a Chicago Bulls player. http://www.ibtimes.com/michael-jordan-sues-qiaodan-sports-company-chinese-company-bearing-his-chinese-name-1226149 — Preceding unsigned comment added by Mjfan3 (talk • contribs) 20:22, 9 February 2015 (UTC)

Article watchers may be interested and are welcome to assist with the expansion of Be Like Mike. ---Another Believer _(Talk) 04:01, 15 February 2015 (UTC)

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pleas change the age to 52

wrong age

182.69.133.195 (talk) 07:18, 17 February 2015 (UTC)

Already done You mean in the infobox? It says 52 right now, and it uses a template to update the age based on the current date, so it would always be correct. Cannolis (talk) 07:41, 17 February 2015 (UTC)

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He was known for being in Gatorade commercials. 208.108.197.160 (talk) 14:06, 18 March 2015 (UTC)

Not done: it's not clear what changes you want to be made. Please mention the specific changes in a "change X to Y" format. — {{U|Technical 13}} (e • t • c) 14:52, 18 March 2015 (UTC)

The page includes 23, 45, and 12. He also played with 9 and 5. 23 being obvious, 45 being the return, and 12 being the game where his jersey was stolen before a game in 1991.

9 in the Olympics and 5 in the 1983 pan-American games.

Here's a photo of #5 http://www.nba.com/dleague/news/stripes_before_stars_1983_panam_2011_10_25.html Dannyexpo (talk) 02:14, 24 March 2015 (UTC)

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The opening section about Michael Jordan spells his name "Jordyn", that is incorrect and offensive. 2601:D:CA80:7100:D8C9:9322:CBD3:C573 (talk) 15:50, 10 April 2015 (UTC)

 Done Vandalism, now corrected - Arjayay (talk) 16:49, 10 April 2015 (UTC)

I think that winning 2 Olympic Gold Medals, and being only 1/7 in basketball history to win an NCAA title, NBA Title, and Gold Medal is lead worthy...not like these kind of accomplishments happen every day...surely it's as worthy of a mention as "Space Jam". Vjmlhds (talk) 18:19, 23 April 2015 (UTC)

The 1/7 part might be better in the "Legacy" section. Impressive, but seems somewhat of a trivial cross-section for the lead.—Bagumba (talk) 18:27, 23 April 2015 (UTC)

The rarity of the accomplishment makes it way more than trivial...trivial is including his minor league baseball batting average in the lead, but being one of only a VERY select few to win the 3 biggest championships in basketball...kind of a big deal. Vjmlhds (talk) 18:36, 23 April 2015 (UTC)

With this edit, you added extra detail to the lead, breaking the lead into five paragraphs. With this edit, I returned the lead to the standard four paragraphs, per WP:Lead without removing your detail. But with this edit, I made a minor tweak, stating, "In fact., Vjmlhds, I'm likely to cut this content you added to the lead. Unless it is WP:Lead material, it should not be in the lead. If you want to discuss this, use the article's talk page instead of mine."

So now that you have brought this matter to the article talk page, I will point to things that the introduction of the WP:Lead guideline states. The first one is where it states, "The lead should be able to stand alone as a concise overview." By that, it means an overview of the article. It then goes on to state, "It should define the topic, establish context, explain why the topic is notable, and summarize the most important points, including any prominent controversies. [...] The emphasis given to material in the lead should roughly reflect its importance to the topic, according to reliable, published sources. Apart from trivial basic facts, significant information should not appear in the lead if it is not covered in the remainder of the article." Wikipedia articles should usually only put things in the lead that have been given significant attention lower in the article. That's what WP:Lead means by "most important points." Is what you added to the lead given significant attention lower in the article? Flyer22 (talk) 07:23, 24 April 2015 (UTC)

I also don't think that this is lead-worthy. Maybe it's just me, but I had never heard of the basketball Triple Crown until it was inserted here. Is it really important enough to merit a spot in the lead. I would say no. Also, the addition went against WP:LEAD because it was not put into the body of the article, meaning that the lead wasn't summarizing content from the body. I moved the sentence to the Legacy section, where it seemed to fit best. Giants2008 (Talk) 18:08, 4 May 2015 (UTC)

Thank you for that, Giants2008. Flyer22 (talk) 00:47, 5 May 2015 (UTC)

Being 1/7 to win the Triple Crown > "Space Jam". Really...is "Space Jam" more important to the article's lead than a rare and significant basketball feat (made rarer by the all the one-and-dones that come out of college)? And I did mention the TC in the body of the article. Vjmlhds (talk) 18:26, 21 May 2015 (UTC)

I have reverted your reinsertion, as I do not see consensus here for it to be in the lead.—Bagumba (talk) 05:51, 22 May 2015 (UTC)

The usage and primary topic of Mike JordanMike Jordan is under discussion, see Talk:Mike Jordan (racing driver) -- 65.94.43.89 (talk) 04:24, 25 May 2015 (UTC)

There has been some recent activity to add highlights to the infobox. For those that were not aware, a style guide exists at Wikipedia:WikiProject_National_Basketball_Association/Style_advice#Infobox_highlights. Feel free to start a discussion at WT:NBA if you are interested in initiating a change in consensus. Thanks.—Bagumba (talk) 00:31, 2 June 2015 (UTC)

I think the section should have a bit more detail and history, including the controversy on his father's death. Also, the section is not noted on the Contents section, which I believe should be moved from professional career to personal life or have its owe section. — Preceding unsigned comment added by JMona12 (talk • contribs) 14:18, 6 July 2015 (UTC)

It may have been the one film but just wondering why there's only a small mention of it on the page?— Preceding unsigned comment added by 86.178.206.185 (talk) 22:36, 26 July 2015‎ (UTC)

What would you propose be changed?—Bagumba (talk) 22:46, 26 July 2015 (UTC)

Washington Wizards comeback (2001–2003)

On September 25, 2001, Jordan announced his return to the NBA to play for the Washington Wizards, indicating his intention to donate his salary as a player to a relief effort for the victims of the September 11, 2001 attacks.^[1][2] In an injury-plagued 2001–02 season, he led the team in scoring (22.9 ppg), assists (5.2 apg), and steals (1.42 spg).^[3] However, torn cartilage in his right knee ended Jordan's season after only 60 games, the fewest he had played in a regular season since playing 17 games after returning from his first retirement during the 1994–95 season.^[4] Jordan started 53 of his 60 games for the season, averaging 24.3 pgg, 5.4 apg, 6 reb, and shooting 41.9% from the field in his 53 starts. After initially sustaining his knee injury, Jordan attempted to come back for 7 more games in a reserve role. He was limited to just 20 minutes per game as a reserve and his knee was nowhere near heatlthy, prompting Jordan to call it a season.^[5]JMarsden1923 (talk) 16:51, 3 August 2015 (UTC)

This appears to have been a request for an addition, since the last part of the above paragraph wasn't in the article. I went ahead and added the statistical parts, which are cited adequately by the given source. Because the website only gives statistics, it doesn't go into the reasons why Jordan became a reserve in the middle of the season or shut himself down. Therefore, I didn't add those parts, although if sources can be found they certainly can be added. Thanks for the suggestion. Giants2008 (Talk) 18:10, 8 August 2015 (UTC)

References

1. [1]

   Pollin Establishes Education Fund, National Basketball Association, September 9, 2002. Retrieved January 16, 2007.
2. [2]

   News Summary, The New York Times, September 26, 2001. Retrieved April 8, 2008.
3. [3]
4. [4]
5. [5]

   http://www.basketball-reference.com/players/j/jordami01/splits/2002/

Shall we mention that he's now a billionaire ? --88.104.133.87 (talk) 22:36, 11 April 2015 (UTC)

I think we should.--88.104.138.119 (talk) 19:18, 17 April 2015 (UTC)

We'll need references then.--88.104.138.119 (talk) 13:44, 18 April 2015 (UTC)

This fact is already included in the lead and body, with references in each place. Giants2008 (Talk) 18:02, 22 April 2015 (UTC)

The article currently states that "In 2015, Jordan became the first athlete in history to become a billionaire, according to Forbes.^[1]" listing yahoo as a source, however Forbes mentioned that Tiger Woods was either already a billionaire or only months away from becoming one back in 2009 before his divorce proceedings http://www.forbes.com/2009/09/29/tiger-woods-billion-business-sports-tiger.html — Preceding unsigned comment added by 70.27.135.114 (talk) 08:25, 9 September 2015 (UTC)

The source for the sentence in the lead said Jordan was "indisputably the best-paid athlete of all-time", which sounds like the kind of vague declaration of fact that could easily be wrong. It also doesn't say that he was the first billionaire athlete; Tiger could have easily beaten him to the mark and then fallen behind Jordan because of his divorce settlement. I changed the sentence to say that he was the first billionaire NBA player, which is adequately supported in the article. Thanks for bringing this issue up. Giants2008 (Talk) 17:13, 17 September 2015 (UTC)

in the personal life section there is a small paragraph about parental lawsuits that seem to assume that the reader has previous information about this topic. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Jayspeed22 (talk • contribs) 20:52, 24 September 2015 (UTC)

I remember that paragraph being reduced in size in the past, probably because of the inherent BLP concerns. The paragraph didn't fully make clear that it was about a court case, so I clarified that. Giants2008 (Talk) 18:12, 30 September 2015 (UTC)

I wasnt sure were to place the net worth of Michael Jordan so I just put it under the sentence it is mentioned that he is the first NBA player to become a billionare. He is worth (on September 3rd 2015 according to Forbes-see source) US$1.1billion^[2]

WikiEditCrunch (talk) 20:29, 3 November 2015 (UTC)Kind Regards WEC

Given that the lead is supposed to be a summary of the article, it probably shouldn't be there. I moved it down to the business-related section, where it seems to fit best. I don't recall seeing a person's net worth being included in too many bios, but most athletes don't have Jordan's wealth. Perhaps others will chime in on whether this is an appropriate addition; in any event, it's in a better spot now, as it isn't significant enough to appear in the lead. The intro already says he's a billionaire anyway. Giants2008 (Talk) 19:15, 6 November 2015 (UTC)

No need for all the template spam as seen at Michael Jordan#External links --Moxy (talk) 04:08, 20 November 2015 (UTC)

He's in all of those templates. There's probably a better way to collapse them, like at Derek Jeter#External links. – Muboshgu (talk) 04:18, 20 November 2015 (UTC)

Just horrible examples of WP:BIDIRECTIONAL spam....thousands of non-related links.That said you make like to comment at Wikipedia talk:Categories, lists, and navigation templates#WP:BIDIRECTIONAL navbox requirements.--Moxy (talk) 05:21, 20 November 2015 (UTC)

The links aren't the problem per se. This could all be converted to succession boxes, and we'd still have the same situation with clutter. Not every list or sequence needs a navbox/succession box, but there is a lack of consensus on how to address it.—Bagumba (talk) 06:48, 20 November 2015 (UTC)

@Moxy: I doubt much has changed on this at WP:NBA since you last brought this up two years back at #Template_spam (still above).—Bagumba (talk) 06:52, 20 November 2015 (UTC)

Just wanted to see if someone would still say its all here because the templates in-question are linked to here over the merits of inclusion. -- Moxy (talk) 07:19, 20 November 2015 (UTC)

I'm not sure if exceptions to BIDIRECTIONAL would work, because someone (esp. driveby IPs) will always blindly add it back citing the guideline. It might be more effective to have an understanding on what is considered too many navboxes on a page, and when a list—typically award winners or team rosters in sports—should be made into a navbox.—Bagumba (talk) 07:30, 20 November 2015 (UTC)

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Micheal Jordan is an african american basketball player.

 Not done Nationality, not ethnicity/race, is what is typically used for the lede. You would never see, "Rick Atkinson, a white author..." GAB^Hello! 22:37, 31 January 2016 (UTC)

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58.96.24.86 (talk) 22:32, 29 February 2016 (UTC)

Not done: it's not clear what changes you want to be made. Please mention the specific changes in a "change X to Y" format. EvergreenFir (talk) Please {{re}} 23:39, 29 February 2016 (UTC)

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i would like to add alot more that i know about him

KorrupTClipz (talk) 18:00, 2 March 2016 (UTC)

Not done: as you have not requested a specific change in the form "Please replace XXX with YYY" or "Please add ZZZ between PPP and QQQ".
More importantly, you have not cited reliable sources to back up your request, without which no information should be added to, or changed in, any article. - Arjayay (talk) 18:22, 2 March 2016 (UTC)

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Add LeBron James to the list of three time winners of finals MVP.

Jordan's six Finals MVPs is a record; Shaquille O'Neal, Magic Johnson, and Tim Duncan are tied for second place with three apiece. Change to: Jordan's six Finals MVPs is a record; Shaquille O'Neal, Magic Johnson, Tim Duncan, and LeBron James are tied for second place with three apiece.

184.146.151.210 (talk) 02:57, 21 June 2016 (UTC)

Done. Thanks. —DangerousJXD (talk) 04:34, 21 June 2016 (UTC)

Michael Jordan's 30.12 career points per game is an NBA record ^[1]. His 33.45 playoffs points per game is also an NBA record ^[2]. There is no indication of these in the "NBA career statistics" section of the article, as is seen in other NBA player articles.

Change the key in "NBA career statistics" to include

and highlight and italicize his career 30.1 PPG and 33.4 playoffs PPG with the same background. This will make the statistics consistent with that of other NBA players.

ZincHead (talk) 15:12, 5 March 2017 (UTC)

 Done Put it in myself ZincHead (talk) 16:40, 7 March 2017 (UTC)

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I have just modified 7 external links on Michael Jordan. Please take a moment to review my edit. If you have any questions, or need the bot to ignore the links, or the page altogether, please visit this simple FaQ for additional information. I made the following changes:

• Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20070630214213/http://www.databasebasketball.com/teams/teamscores.htm?tm=CHI&yr=1984&lg=n to http://www.databasebasketball.com/teams/teamscores.htm?tm=CHI&yr=1984&lg=n
• Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20071014212808/http://databasebasketball.com/teams/teampage.htm?tm=CHI&lg=n to http://www.databasebasketball.com/teams/teampage.htm?tm=CHI&lg=N
• Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20070630214329/http://www.databasebasketball.com/teams/teamscores.htm?tm=CHI&yr=1987&lg=n to http://www.databasebasketball.com/teams/teamscores.htm?tm=CHI&yr=1987&lg=n
• Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20070630214229/http://www.databasebasketball.com/teams/teamscores.htm?tm=CHI&lg=N&yr=1990 to http://www.databasebasketball.com/teams/teamscores.htm?tm=CHI&yr=1990&lg=n
• Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20160125082214/http://www.databasebasketball.com/teams/teamscores.htm?tm=CHI&yr=1995&lg=n to http://www.databasebasketball.com/teams/teamscores.htm?tm=CHI&yr=1995&lg=n
• Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20160125082249/http://www.databasebasketball.com/teams/teamscores.htm?tm=CHI&yr=1996&lg=n to http://www.databasebasketball.com/teams/teamscores.htm?tm=CHI&yr=1996&lg=n
• Corrected formatting/usage for https://www.nytimes.com/2011/11/05/sports/basketball/hard-line-factions-threaten-latest-nba-negotiations.html?ref=basketball

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Cheerleading Career Michael Jordan was a member of the Laney High School cheerleading squad for two years before joining the Junior Varsity basketball team.^[1] Sarahbean123 (talk) 20:03, 1 October 2017 (UTC)

Not done: it's not clear what changes you want to be made. Please mention the specific changes in a "change X to Y" format. SparklingPessimist ^{Scream at me!} 21:44, 1 October 2017 (UTC)

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The best NBA player in history of basketball. You may now him for his shoes number 1-33 or for the crazy dunk that he did from the free throw line. Micheal Jordan won 6 NBA rings with his close buddie Scottie Pippen.

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Official.Ethan (talk) 00:45, 30 November 2017 (UTC)

Not done: it's not clear what changes you want to be made. Please mention the specific changes in a "change X to Y" format. Giants2008 (Talk) 00:49, 30 November 2017 (UTC)

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Jordan is the goat, don't say people say he is the goat. He simply is the OG and GOAT. 2601:183:8680:23D0:A085:EEA5:A60F:3552 (talk) 00:01, 20 December 2017 (UTC)

Not done: Even though that is a widely hide opinion, it is still an opinion all the same and not something that should be said in Wikipedia's voice. Attributing the viewpoint is in line with our content policies, and removing the attributions wouldn't help the article maintain a neutral point of view. Giants2008 (Talk) 00:52, 20 December 2017 (UTC)

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Michael Jordan Bulls Team won their 1st Championship in the 1991-92 season, not 1990-91. The Bulls went on to 3-peat winning in seasons 1992-93, and 1993-94. After 1994, Jordan retired to play baseball missing the NBA season 1994-95. 2601:403:1:24F3:D99B:847A:D523:88AC (talk) 22:11, 28 December 2017 (UTC)

Not done: it's not clear what changes you want to be made. Please mention the specific changes in a "change X to Y" format. If you are referring to the article lead, the sentence "In 1991, he won his first NBA championship with the Bulls, and followed that achievement with titles in 1992 and 1993, securing a 'three-peat'." is correct. The first Finals Jordan's Bulls teams won was the 1991 Finals. See: this] for reference. Eggishorn (talk) (contrib) 22:49, 28 December 2017 (UTC)

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Michael Jordan was taught by a little girl named Mariah Jones Messi.junior.0944 (talk) 14:56, 24 January 2018 (UTC)

Not done: it's not clear what changes you want to be made. Please mention the specific changes in a "change X to Y" format and provide a reliable source if appropriate. —KuyaBriBri^Talk 15:15, 24 January 2018 (UTC)

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I want to change his Wikipedia because he has a cousin who got a husband and I want to change his name. 104.33.193.140 (talk) 03:05, 29 January 2018 (UTC)

 Not done: please provide reliable sources that support the change you want to be made. Anon126 (notify me of responses! / talk / contribs) 03:16, 29 January 2018 (UTC)

I changed "is an American retired professional basketball player, businessman, and principal owner and chairman of the Charlotte Hornets of the National Basketball Association (NBA). " to "is an American retired baseball and professional basketball player, businessman, and principal owner and chairman of the Charlotte Hornets of the National Basketball Association (NBA). " Even if he played very little, he was still a baseball player and that should be added.— Preceding unsigned comment added by Riahc3 (talk • contribs) 09:36, 18 March 2018 (UTC)

I wouldn't be a big fan of that change. His baseball career certainly doesn't deserve to be mentioned before we even say he was a basketball player, as the latter is what Jordan is best known for. Giants2008 (Talk) 14:05, 18 March 2018 (UTC)

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give me or ur mean 42.241.220.19 (talk) 09:38, 26 March 2018 (UTC)

 Not done: it's not clear what changes you want to be made. Please mention the specific changes in a "change X to Y" format and provide a reliable source if appropriate. DRAGON BOOSTER ★ 09:42, 26 March 2018 (UTC)

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there is some in correct information could i pls help u make it better. 42.241.220.19 (talk) 09:36, 26 March 2018 (UTC)

 Not done This is not the right page to request additional user rights.
If you want to suggest a change, please request this in the form "Please replace XXX with YYY" or "Please add ZZZ between PPP and QQQ".
Please also cite reliable sources to back up your request, without which no information should be added to, or changed in, any article. - Arjayay (talk) 09:53, 26 March 2018 (UTC)

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Cochambablues (talk) 02:15, 2 June 2018 (UTC)

this is bullshit that i have to request to edit a page. there are some inaccuracies on this page and i just want to fix them, does that answer your question

 Not done: it's not clear what changes you want to be made. Please mention the specific changes in a "change X to Y" format and provide a reliable source if appropriate. – Muboshgu (talk) 02:25, 2 June 2018 (UTC)

The following Wikimedia Commons file used on this page has been nominated for deletion:

• Basketball Clipart.svg

Participate in the deletion discussion at the nomination page. Community Tech bot (talk) 03:01, 6 June 2018 (UTC)

Do you guys like the cropped picture on the front? Lemonpasta (talk) 02:22, 25 May 2018 (UTC)

It appears that another editor has removed the cropped photo from the lead. My guess is that various editors were having problems with the crop itself. Several edits were made to adjust it, but the photo always looked large in the infobox and verged on distorting Jordan's appearance. If you really want a cropped version of this image in the lead, the best advice I can give is to visit the Graphics Lab's photography workshop; the image cleanup experts who respond to requests there may be able to help. Giants2008 (Talk) 15:16, 7 June 2018 (UTC)

You should add his USA Olympic #9 number to his career jersey numbers Ghetto2315 (talk) 01:32, 3 July 2018 (UTC)

@Ghetto2315: The documentation of career_numbersfor {{Infobox basketball biography}} says that only pro numbers are generally listed. There was no consensus to list national team numbers when it was discussed at Wikipedia_talk:WikiProject_National_Basketball_Association/Archive_25#Michael_Jordan_wearing_the_#12.—Bagumba (talk) 09:46, 3 July 2018 (UTC)

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Excuse me kind protectors of Michael Jordan "The GOAT"'s Wikipedia page but I would like to kindly request to insert a small falic penis into the source of code for the page project Please - scribed by: A kind basketball enthusiast. 2001:8003:6BA4:2600:CEF:A90:8935:9097 (talk) 12:28, 8 July 2018 (UTC)

 Not done: it's not clear what changes you want to be made. Please mention the specific changes in a "change X to Y" format and provide a reliable source if appropriate. L293D (☎ • ✎) 13:18, 8 July 2018 (UTC)

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My Name is FUUU (talk) 17:31, 13 November 2018 (UTC)

Not done: it's not clear what changes you want to be made. Please mention the specific changes in a "change X to Y" format and provide a reliable source if appropriate. Giants2008 (Talk) 18:06, 13 November 2018 (UTC)

I'm tempted to add in a minor detail about how he did an Anti-drug PSA (sonsorede by McDonalds)that has recently become infamous (better known as the internet meme "Stop it, get some help!"). But I'm not sure if it would belong. What does everyone think?

Geekynerdyguy1996 (talk) 16:43, 25 October 2018 (UTC)

To add this detail to the article, you'll need to provide a reliable source supporting the new content. I did a quick Google search and found a bunch of blog posts and the like, but couldn't find anything that I'd call reliable enough for a BLP. Giants2008 (Talk) 18:08, 14 November 2018 (UTC)

According to the data collected by B-R Michael Jordan only averaged 26.8 ppg as a Senior, also the biography Michael Jordan: The Life states that he only averaged 6 assists that year. — Preceding unsigned comment added by And12392 (talk • contribs) 12:10, 13 December 2018 (UTC)

Thank you for pointing out those discrepencies, And12392. I'd say this is probably a case of more information being available now than when that sentence was written, as the sources you provided didn't exist at the time. The Basketball-Reference page also allowed for Jordan's two-year varsity scoring average to be made more accurate, making it doubly useful. Unfortunately, it doesn't provide any details on his rebounding or assist figures. Lazenby rounds those numbers in his book (which I have a copy of), and I couldn't find precise senior-year averages elsewhere that differ from the ones we had, so I added his figures and indicated in the text that sources differ. Until rebound and assist totals as comprehensive as the Basketball-Reference point details are published for his high school career, this is arguably the best we can do. Giants2008 (Talk) 03:57, 18 December 2018 (UTC)

@Giants2008 and And12392: It seems that a couple of newspapers in 1981 were consistent with Roland Lazenby's Michael Jordan: The Life about the 6 assists. In March 1981, an Associated Press article in the Rocky Mount Telegram wrote "Jordan, also a 6-foot-4 guard, averaged 27.8 points, 12 rebounds, and 6 assists." In April, the Orlando Sentinel published: "Jordan averaged 27.6 points, 9.8 rebounds and 6 assists per game, while Peterson's sheet showed 24.6 points. From what I can see from Google, articles saying that Jordan had a triple-double in his senior year start appearing as early as 2009, perhaps based on the 2007 book from David L. Porter. At this point, it's more than a Porter vs. Lazenby conflict as is currently presented in the article; there's multiple conflicting articles on both sides. Some options moving forward include:

1. Remove in-text attribution to Lazenby and Porter, and instead say generally that mutliple sources conflict, while providing a sample of the sources in citations.
2. Move mention of the assists and triple-double out of the main text and into a footnote that describes the conflict.
3. Remove mention of the assists and triple-double altogether.

I'm currently leaning towards option 2. Further suggestions are appreciated.—Bagumba (talk) 18:15, 26 January 2019 (UTC)

The text about the triple-double was added by an IP (with only one edit in their history) on May 20, 2006: "In his senior season at Laney High, Jordan became the only player in high school history to average a triple-double, when he averaged 29.2 points, 11.6 rebounds, and 10.1 assists. This was only sourced almost a year later on February 25, 2007, by AaronY citing a SportsCenter episode on February 2, 2007, with no online reference to the episode provided.. The article was nominated for FA on March 6, 2007, by User:Quadzilla99 (former username of AaronY). That SportsCenter citation remained on Wikipedia until it was replaced on December 18, 2018. Based on this timeline, there is a WP:CIRCULAR concern that the cited 2007 SportsCenter episode and 2007 Porter book could very well have based their information on the original unsourced Wikipedia edit, and then Wikipedia went and cited those sources. Unless we find a reliable source to support this that was published before May 20, 2006, the original date it was added unsourced to Wikipedia, this should be removed as unreliable.—Bagumba (talk) 20:37, 26 January 2019 (UTC)

Good detective work, Bagumba. My support goes to option 2 for the assists and option 3 for the "triple-double". I was the one who made the edit that swapped out the SportsCenter reference, in the process of editing the article following the previous comment here. My recollection from the research I did then is that the sources saying Jordan had a triple-double were post-2006, leading me to believe your theory has merit. We should definitely remove that if a source without circular reporting can't be found quickly. I wouldn't be opposed to making a note for the assists (and possibly the rebounds as well). That would make it easier to add stats from one or two of the newspaper articles, as any more explanation of the differences is likely too much detail for the body of the article. Giants2008 (Talk) 02:48, 27 January 2019 (UTC)

I'm leaning towards mention in the body that he averaged 6 assists with no further explanatory footnote needed. It's too suspicious that sources in 1981 say it was 6, and other sources dont say 10 until after it was added and remained unsourced to Wikipedia. I also give more weight to longtime sports writer Lazenby than Porter, a general education author. Given the strong WP:CIRCULAR concern, we would need a source to explain the discrepancy to give more credence to the claim of 10. It would be too simplistic now for Wikipedia to just point out that sources conflict.—Bagumba (talk) 06:37, 28 January 2019 (UTC)

I made this edit. The stats are rounded to whole numbers to normalize with the 6 assists, the variance of a few tenths in rebounds among different sources isn't worth getting into the article.—Bagumba (talk) 10:55, 3 February 2019 (UTC)

Sounds fine to me. Giants2008 (Talk) 02:36, 7 February 2019 (UTC)

Giants2008 (talk · contribs) suggested that we discuss https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Michael_Jordan&diff=881889088&oldid=881845763 . While it is always good to have more than one source, the Chicago Tribune is more than sufficient to qualify as a cite to support rumors being widespread for years about Jordan's gambling. The brevity of the mention is, if anything, even more of an indicator; it assumes that this is widely known. Ylee (talk) 23:53, 5 February 2019 (UTC)

In the case of a highly sensitive topic in a BLP, I'd certainly expect more than one source to have written about such a topic for it to even be considered for addition to an article. This is an old conspiracy theory, and we shouldn't be spreading rumors about living subjects in BLP (that goes for both Jordan and the commissioner who stands accused of suspending him, incidentally). Even the person quoted in the source said they didn't believe it was true. If it wasn't true, then I don't see how it belongs in the article, as the addition does leave the impression that Jordan was "punished", in its own words; the "According to widespread rumor" part really makes it sound like it actually happened. For the record, it appears that there were past discussions on this topic here and here, and although they predate the time I joined the site, it appears that neither resulted in a consensus for adding content on the rumors. Giants2008 (Talk) 02:52, 7 February 2019 (UTC)

The previous Talk discussions occurred because there was no reliable, citable source involved. The rumor's existence is undeniable; it is so widespread and famous that [Bill Simmons asked David Stern about it. http://www.espn.com/espn/page2/story?page=simmons/060216] The section on Jordan's gambling already exists, and is not in dispute; the disputed text (on the alleged secret suspension) refutes the rumor, as opposed to supporting it, and are two sentences to be added to the existing gambling discussion. As it stands, a reliable source a) states the rumor's widespread nature, and b) quotes another reliable source explaining why the rumor is false. The Simmons article would also perform a) and b), and would be cited as well. There is abundant Wikiprecedent for such an approach to rumors, and this fulfills the conditions WP:PUBLICFIGURE requires without triggering WP:BLPGOSSIP. Ylee (talk) 08:04, 7 February 2019 (UTC)

I'm leaning towards a short mention of the rumor along with the fact it's been denied by Jordan and Stern and never been proved. There has been continued mention of the topic in sources. Per the policy WP:PUBLICFIGURE, If an allegation or incident is noteworthy, relevant, and well documented, it belongs in the article—even if it is negative and the subject dislikes all mention of it. Here's a sample of the sources:

• The New York Times. 1995. "David Stern says there was no secret suspension for gambling, and I believe the N.B.A.'s commissioner. You can't hide something like that."
• The New York Times. 2005. "Jordan would sit out a year or two, my friend theorized, rather than having Stern suspend him for gambling ... No such scenario has ever been proved, and Jordan has never been charged with doing anything illegal."
• USA Today. 2013. "Film director Ron Shelton, who made a documentary about Jordan’s year in the minors as part of ESPN’s 30 for 30 series, told the Chicago Tribune in 2010 that he found nothing to support that thesis."
• Roland Lazenby. Michael Jordan: The Life. 2014. A whole page in the book on the subject: "The comment would spark yet more intrigue and speculation that Jordan, during his discussions with David Stern, had been told to retire, perhaps even forced out."
• The Washington Post. 2015. "No word on whether Jordan was also invited to the wedding, or if, while on the links, he confessed to Brady that the rumors are true about his short-lived baseball career really being the result of an NBA suspension for gambling."
• The Undefeated. 2017. "Despite rumors that his foray into baseball resulted from a secret suspension levied by the NBA for gambling, Jordan maintained that he gained inspiration from his late father, who played semipro baseball and frequently had conversations with his son about making the switch."
• Associated Press. 2017. "But then, I didn’t know Michael Jordan’s first retirement was actually a 'secret suspension' imposed by former Commissioner David Stern for gambling."

Thank you for the additional cites. I plan on using some of them, but only expanding the disputed text in question to mention that Stern denied the rumor. (I don't think any of the above cites (includng the Undefeated one) says that Jordan explicitly denied the rumor, as opposed to his father's death inspiring him to try baseball (which is well known).) The rumor certainly does not deserve more than a cursory mention, for both BLP and WP:UNDUE reasons, but it does deserve a mention. Ylee (talk) 11:07, 7 February 2019 (UTC)

You are right, I don't think Jordan has denied it. The Undefeated wrote that he "maintained that he gained inspiration from his late father" about baseball. In that same article, Kenny Lofton said Jordan told him "Baseball was my first love", and Lofton speculated that he was living out his childhood dream. In another article, Phil Jackson said "It was really his father's dream that he play baseball. His father wanted to play pro ball and did play semi-pro. When his father passed away, I think Michael was kind of living out his father's dream."—Bagumba (talk) 12:05, 7 February 2019 (UTC)

In the absence of further discussion, I have restored the disputed text, adding the cite stating that Stern denied the rumor in 1995. Ylee (talk) 08:15, 17 February 2019 (UTC)

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Remove "He is largely considered to be the 2nd greatest player in NBA history" From the first paragraph as no source is given and it appears to be speculation and or personal opinion. 69.113.98.116 (talk) 15:04, 16 March 2019 (UTC)

 Done—Bagumba (talk) 15:19, 16 March 2019 (UTC)

He retired with 32,292 points in regular season play,[174] placing him fourth on the NBA's all-time scoring list behind Kareem Abdul-Jabbar, Karl Malone, and Kobe Bryant.[174]

He has since been overtaken by Lebron James — Preceding unsigned comment added by 2003:ED:CF31:B500:19CE:EC90:C479:AB28 (talk) 20:17, 27 March 2019 (UTC)

An editor recently changed the lead from the phrase "According to the NBA's official website, "by acclamation, Michael Jordan is the greatest basketball player of all time" to "Michael Jordan is widely regarded as the greatest basketball player of all time". This change in phrasing reflects a different meaning and does not weigh the NBA's view. Could we please revert the change? - 2600:1702:31B0:9CE0:F8AB:2864:B4F4:39BE (talk) 00:15, 1 April 2019 (UTC)

The change was made by Vercors63. I reverted, stating, "Restored this per the talk page. No doubt this was discussed a lot, which is why we simply defer to what the National Basketball Association states on the matter. Better than having to add multiple sources like we do at the LeBron James article." It also takes care of those who might add a Template:By whom or Template:According to whom tag for "widely regarded as" wording...even though WP:In-text attribution in that case would be misleading since many sources have stated that Jordan is the greatest basketball player, or widely regarded as the greatest basketball player, ever. Flyer22 Reborn (talk) 22:38, 1 April 2019 (UTC)

Does anyone see an issue at Michael Jordan#"I'm back": Return to the NBA (1995) with calling "I'm back" a "two-word press release"? Koui² has reverted multiple times in a slow edit war, initially insisting that it was really three words, and lately replacing "two-word" with "laconic".—Bagumba (talk) 09:52, 17 March 2019 (UTC)

Looks fine to me, although I'm the one who first changed the wording back to the original version after "I'm back" was said to be three words, which it clearly isn't. Giants2008 (Talk) 22:04, 3 April 2019 (UTC)

I'd like to make an edit stating that although Jordan played in the triangle offense, which is predicated on his jumpshooting abilities, he still put up impressive assist and rebounding stats. One shouldn't expect him to do so, unlike with an offense with a ball-dominant player. - 2600:1702:31B0:9CE0:722A:D5FF:FE5F:7FD2 (talk) 21:40, 22 May 2019 (UTC)

One shouldn't expect an efficient field goal percentage, either. - 2600:1702:31B0:9CE0:722A:D5FF:FE5F:7FD2 (talk) 21:42, 22 May 2019 (UTC)

Unless you can find a reliable source that states that "Jordan put up impressive assist and rebounding stats despite playing in the triangle offense, which is predicated on his jumpshooting abilities", it is your opinion that he did so and your opinions does not belong in the article. See WP:OR and WP:NPOV. General Ization ^Talk 23:45, 25 May 2019 (UTC)

Even if a source was found to support the statement, we'd want to avoid using the word "impressive", since it could be considered POV language. Giants2008 (Talk) 01:17, 15 June 2019 (UTC)

This photo perpetuates racist, white supremacist fuckery, where a row of all white men stand in front of a row of all black men. This image should, at the very least, be cropped to showcase the actual subject of the article, Michael Jordan. Ideally, this image would be completely replaced with one that showcases Michael Jordan.

Are you being serious? How is that racist? --Mazewaxie 09:22, 15 June 2019 (UTC)

I suggest that if a consensus emerges for a cropped photo, anyone interested should be bold and crop it on Commons, or pay a visit to the Graphics Lab. They do a lot of good work related to improving existing images, and this should be in their wheelhouse. Giants2008 (Talk) 00:19, 4 July 2019 (UTC)

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In the locker room Michael Jordan resorted to trying to embarrass Cartwright in front of the team. He was offensive to the point that afterward, Cartwright pulled him to the side and said

"Look, if you ever do anything like that again, you will never play basketball again because I will break both of your legs."

But Michael Jordan did not mean any of this Beast-brox17 (talk) 08:49, 14 October 2019 (UTC)

 Not done: it's not clear what changes you want to be made. Please mention the specific changes in a "change X to Y" format and provide a reliable source if appropriate. NiciVampireHeart 11:34, 14 October 2019 (UTC)

Exxcalibur808 has changed Jordan's playoff scoring average from 33.4 to 33.5, claiming that it should round up. I've changed it back multiple times, as Basketball-Reference and another source I added don't indicate that it rounds up, giving the 33.4 figure. So that we don't end up in an edit war on this point, would any other editors like to offer their opinions on the topic? If the math is done on the point total, it comes to an average of 33.44692737, in case that helps. Giants2008 (Talk) 13:44, 24 February 2020 (UTC)

The sources look correct with 33.4. It would have to be >= 33.450 to round up, but it's at 33.447. It's incorrect math to round up twice: once from 33.447 to 33.45, and then a second time to 33.5.—Bagumba (talk) 14:32, 24 February 2020 (UTC)

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Jordan attended Murdoch. IOpty (talk) 07:53, 27 May 2020 (UTC)

 Not done: please provide reliable sources that support the change you want to be made. Additionally, it's not clear what changes you want to be made. Please mention the specific changes in a "change X to Y" format. Jack Frost (talk) 10:24, 27 May 2020 (UTC)

Trivial, but Jordan's official NBA.com page lists him at 216 lbs:

http://www.nba.com/historical/playerfile/index.html?player=michael_jordan

8/23/11 — Preceding unsigned comment added by Hubertdavisfor3 (talk • contribs) 16:47, 23 August 2011 (UTC)

We probably should go with that. I don't know where 215 comes from. Zagalejo^^^ 23:41, 23 August 2011 (UTC)

current is way ou of line, and unsourced. 218? https://eu.usatoday.com/story/gameon/2013/02/15/michael-jordan-playing-weight-espn/1922419/ JCJC777 (talk) 20:14, 4 July 2020 (UTC)

I changed it back to 216, with an NBA.com reference. Giants2008 (Talk) 22:19, 6 July 2020 (UTC)

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Please update reference #11 URL from www.23jordan.com/bio1.htm to https://23jordan.com/bio, the link currently referenced is no longer valid and has been replaced by the web site owner.

Davekoll (talk) 04:59, 31 July 2020 (UTC)

There was an archived url there that was working, so I just switched it. The bigger question is whether 23jordan.com is a reliable source? Not sure who maintains it; there has to be less questionable sources with the same basic info. In fact, the same footnote 11 also has a reference to Sachare's The Chicago Bulls Encyclopedia. Not sure to what extent the 23jordan is even needed.—Bagumba (talk) 05:23, 31 July 2020 (UTC)

From what I can see it's still referencing the archived URL. Can you please update the line so it references https://23jordan.com/bio? I maintain the site and the URL was changed when I updated the site. The content on the biography page has remained the same except for some updates since his retirement. Thanks. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 192.150.85.1 (talk) 01:34, 17 August 2020 (UTC)

I looked at the page and it appears to be an unreliable fan site. Sorry, but it's really not something we should be citing on Wikipedia, let alone to an FA on a high-profile BLP. I've taken the liberty of replacing it with book references and a cite to a newspaper article already used as a reference. Giants2008 (Talk) 22:28, 25 August 2020 (UTC)

His 43.7 ppg in the 1986 playoffs should be highlighted in purple as it's an NBA record. Source: https://www.basketball-reference.com/leaders/pts_per_g_season_p.html — Preceding unsigned comment added by 142.59.169.87 (talk) 07:04, 20 November 2020 (UTC)

There has never been consensus that annual playoff stats leaders are significant. See Wikipedia_talk:WikiProject_National_Basketball_Association/Archive_22#Playoff_stats_leaders_for_a_given_year. Feel free to start a discussion at WT:NBA to change this.—Bagumba (talk) 08:46, 20 November 2020 (UTC)

in the media sub category can you please mention that michael jordan starred in the michael jackson music video 'Jam' in 1991, and that they were good friends during this time.— Preceding unsigned comment added by Coolbb (talk • contribs) 19:38, 31 December 2011 (UTC)

Seems to be added now.—Bagumba (talk) 08:41, 24 November 2020 (UTC)

Another request-retired and former don't need to be used together. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 182.251.192.83 (talk) 07:12, 19 January 2021 (UTC)

Fixed.—Bagumba (talk) 07:40, 19 January 2021 (UTC)

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213.160.227.25 (talk) 09:47, 26 January 2021 (UTC)

He was a goat

 Not done: it's not clear what changes you want to be made. Please mention the specific changes in a "change X to Y" format and provide a reliable source if appropriate. Volteer1 (talk) 10:22, 26 January 2021 (UTC)

Is there a possibility to include or link a video regarding the game with the backboard smash on August 25, 1985 in the article. I don't know whether this is permissible or how it should be done. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=te-8MJ84834 Best regards --Schi11 (talk) 09:18, 17 January 2021 (UTC)

@Schi11: WP:YOUTUBE is the relevant guideline. It's a matter of whether or not there are any copyright issues.—Bagumba (talk) 09:39, 17 January 2021 (UTC)

I find it very difficult with the copy right because in this case, for example, someone in Trieste filmed it and has rights to it. Or is it free because it has already been accessed millions of times on YouTube and can be used on Wikipedia. Maybe my lack of understanding is stupid, but somehow the guidelines make it difficult for me too. --Schi11 (talk) 09:54, 17 January 2021 (UTC)

I'm not the biggest expert on video copyrights. One big concern is whether the person uploading this just copied the whole thing from somewhere else, which Wikipedia would not want to link to. In this case, the video description says "i recorded it in the year 1986 in a sports program of the Spanish television". If they took someone else's video, but edited it into a mix and added music, the law gives some creative leeway. Don't ask me where this falls.—Bagumba (talk) 10:09, 17 January 2021 (UTC)

One thing I know for certain is that the number of views a video gets on YouTube has nothing to do with its licensing status. My presumption is that, if the broadcast appeared on a Spanish television station in 1986, the copyright holder (the station?) would have to release the footage under an acceptable license. If that doesn't happen, the video would fall under the non-free content criteria; it would likely fail criterion 1, as there are many free images of Jordan available (and already included in the article). Hope this helps. Giants2008 (Talk) 17:24, 5 February 2021 (UTC)

NBA.com's old bio of Jordan ("By acclamation...", nbah, currently ref 5) appears to be back online (archive) as part of commemoration of his 58th birthday, with a couple extra paragraphs at the end.

As it lacks the Career Statistics footer of the old one, it's being used to cite stats, and I saw no other substantial differences, I will not update it in the article (but won't contest others who do). —an odd name 17:23, 17 February 2021 (UTC)

It's not unheard of for a source's content to change over time, or for a new version to lack some content that has been cited. Given that the stats are missing, I agree with keeping the archived version currently in use. Giants2008 (Talk) 16:08, 15 March 2021 (UTC)

He invented Jordans(THE BEST SNEAKER EVERRRRRRRR! — Preceding unsigned comment added by SneakerHead182 (talk • contribs) 17:33, 22 February 2021 (UTC)

 Not done: it's not clear what changes you want to be made. Please mention the specific changes in a "change X to Y" format and provide a reliable source if appropriate. Giants2008 (Talk) 16:38, 23 March 2021 (UTC)

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michal Jordan played basket ball for 1 year and then played baseball and got a scholarship to football his mom loved him he made nike airmags Canu2027 (talk) 13:04, 25 March 2021 (UTC)

 Not done: it's not clear what changes you want to be made. Please mention the specific changes in a "change X to Y" format and provide a reliable source if appropriate.—Bagumba (talk) 13:08, 25 March 2021 (UTC)

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Error: Need valid birth date: year, month, day 80.187.110.73 (talk) 06:52, 21 April 2021 (UTC) Disregard. Clicked submit on accident.

I just noticed that the font, format, and size of the categories in this page and certain others (e.g. Quincy Jones) are larger than others. What is the reason for this? 2001:569:78BA:4A00:1DF4:989C:F487:3F2E (talk) 20:00, 20 May 2021 (UTC)

I've seen the category font size be different than usual in another article (can't remember which one off the top of my head). According to this thread at WP:VPT, there's been some font size weirdness in general on the site today. My guess is that the sizing of the categories is related to these issues. Giants2008 (Talk) 22:37, 20 May 2021 (UTC)

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The height is given wrong in meters. Please edit! 6 ft 6 inch will be 2.01 meters. Hamiensules (talk) 18:18, 1 July 2021 (UTC)

 Not done: You are incorrect. The number in the article is the correct conversion. ScottishFinnishRadish (talk) 18:25, 1 July 2021 (UTC)

Under "Business ventures" it says "His restaurants include a steakhouse in New York City's Grand Central Terminal," but the Grand Central Terminal location closed in 2018.

Updated the sentence to reflect the closure. Thanks for pointing that out. Giants2008 (Talk) 01:32, 24 July 2021 (UTC)

The following Wikimedia Commons file used on this page or its Wikidata item has been nominated for deletion:

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Participate in the deletion discussion at the nomination page. —Community Tech bot (talk) 13:08, 13 August 2021 (UTC)

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MJ actually played 14 seasons in the NBA, not 15. You can easily count them (9 in his first run with the Bulls + 3 in his second run and then 2 more with the Wizards). Todortodd (talk) 08:24, 27 August 2021 (UTC)

 Not done: You might not have counted the year he came back, 1994–95. Career totals at https://www.basketball-reference.com/players/j/jordami01.html#all_per_game-playoffs_per_game (bottom) show 13 with Bulls and 2 with Wizards.—Bagumba (talk) 08:29, 27 August 2021 (UTC)

Yeah, I guess you're correct! thanks— Preceding unsigned comment added by Todortodd (talk • contribs) 12:36, 27 August 2021 (UTC)

Hi, I just saw that the references section of this article is missing. Is there a problem? 2001:569:78BA:4A00:8CEE:361F:11D2:6C29 (talk) 19:04, 29 August 2021 (UTC)

It's there Michael_Jordan#References - FlightTime (open channel) 19:13, 29 August 2021 (UTC)

Can't speak for what other users are seeing on their monitors, but the reference section shows up just fine for me. Giants2008 (Talk) 19:19, 29 August 2021 (UTC)

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Hi I am doing this for the first time but when I seat micheal Jordan Wikipedia in the little text box it says that he is an American baseball player 50.4.216.200 (talk) 16:21, 11 September 2021 (UTC)

 Not done: it's not clear what changes you want to be made. Please mention the specific changes in a "change X to Y" format and provide a reliable source if appropriate. It seems that you are referring to the short description, which (at least now) is "American basketball player and businessman". — LauritzT (talk) 18:27, 11 September 2021 (UTC)

For the Chicago Bulls it has 1984-1993 then 1995-1988, this should be 1998.— Preceding unsigned comment added by 24.247.221.185 (talk) 04:13, 25 October 2021 (UTC)

Fixed. Thanks.—Bagumba (talk) 04:36, 25 October 2021 (UTC)

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Final paragraph of Introduction contains a number of typos

Change "The most effectively marketed athletes of his generation," to "One of the most..." or "...athlete" depending on the source.

Change "documentary's" to "documentaries".

Change "richiest" to "richest".

"In 2014, became the first billionaire player in NBA history." Insert "he" before "became".

There are two spaces between "2.2" and "billion". Delete one.

Baconerd (talk) 08:13, 12 January 2022 (UTC)

 Done ScottishFinnishRadish (talk) 11:47, 12 January 2022 (UTC)

“Documentary's” needs to be changed to “documentaries”. 2A00:23C6:4C95:BB01:28E0:AEA7:6213:A47C (talk) 11:27, 16 January 2022 (UTC)

Fixed. Thanks.—Bagumba (talk) 12:52, 16 January 2022 (UTC)

This article is or was the subject of a Wiki Education Foundation-supported course assignment. Further details are available on the course page. Student editor(s): Aabdul24.

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This article was the subject of a Wiki Education Foundation-supported course assignment, between 22 October 2018 and 16 December 2018. Further details are available on the course page. Student editor(s): Dgosnell123.

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I would consider the sentence regarding the quote on his official NBA biography as against Wikipedia:Neutral point of view guidelines. It clearly suggests that he is the "greatest basketball player of all time", a statement that is not verifiable. The fact that many people agree with the point is irrelevant as the statement is still an opinion and its popularity has no effect on its accuracy. Curiocity1 (talk) 16:09, 28 January 2022 (UTC)

Jordan "has failed spectacularly as an NBA owner" after 12 losing seasons out of 16 and firing yet another coach. I can't currently link to it (some people may be able to use this one) but it's in my actual newspaper. Is this appropriate to include?— Vchimpanzee • talk • contributions • 15:34, 23 April 2022 (UTC)

• @Vchimpanzee: It would be inappropriate to call Jordan a failure as an owner in Wikipedia's voice, for BLP reasons, but an attributed opinion to the author may be useful, depending on the contents of the article and the standing of the author. Preferably it would have some stats and the like that back up the opinion and may be worthy of inclusion. Unfortunately, I can't read the article so I can't say whether this should be included. I'm a Knicks fan myself, so my standard for calling something NBA-related a failure has become extremely high over the years. Giants2008 (Talk) 15:45, 15 May 2022 (UTC)

  Yes, it's more important to state objective facts about the team's overall performance under his ownership. Without the columnist having his own Wikipedia article, most readers might think "Who's he? So what?" when it comes to his opinion.—Bagumba (talk) 16:12, 15 May 2022 (UTC)

Okay. While you wouldn't know it not being from around here, Scott Fowler is about as prestigious as it gets for sports commentary in Charlotte, but whether he is entitled to a Wikipedia article I can't say.

I tried linking to the article but it doesn't show up when I do the search, so I don't know what happened.— Vchimpanzee • talk • contributions • 17:56, 15 May 2022 (UTC)

This is NOT one of those wild conspiracy theories in the slightest. The media has painted his points per game number to be completely different than what it truly is. It seems that basketball statistic websites remove his last season or the season he came back from baseball to acquire his 30.12 points per game. However in both instances, he did in fact play. His overall career average is 29.45 points per game. It’s rather small in the grand scheme of things, and you can fact check me if you wish. Add every single ppg season together and divide it by 15. This will get you 29.45333 or 29.45. This small little fact of 30.12 to 29.45 actually changes the all time career points per game with this small change. Wilt would be number 1 with 30.08 points per game in his career. This is why it is so vital that this he fixed to accurately represent the truth and facts of the NBA. If you fix this first, then others will wonder what is going on as well and will start a chain reaction to fixing the truth. Someone down the line screwed with MJ’s stats and I know Mj wouldn’t want that either. He just wants his ACTUAL stats to be displayed and wouldn’t care too much. I URGE you to do that math as well just so you can see that I am in fact correct on this matter. 98.174.99.113 (talk) 21:55, 28 July 2022 (UTC)

Wikipedia does not accept original research. Reliable sources calculate career scoring average by dividing one's total career points by their total games played. Seasons played is not part of the calculation.—Bagumba (talk) 00:36, 29 July 2022 (UTC)

Michael Jordan played with the number nine in both Olympic games Vixir087 (talk) 14:48, 13 August 2022 (UTC)

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i wish to make easier and add more source info 204.11.186.254 (talk) 17:56, 12 September 2022 (UTC)

 Not done: it's not clear what changes you want to be made. Please mention the specific changes in a "change X to Y" format and provide a reliable source if appropriate. General Ization ^Talk 18:24, 12 September 2022 (UTC)

There's a typo that reads "Colling" when it should read Collins based on the ppname of the Chicago Bulls head coach Doug Collins. 2601:145:8001:B0F0:CD37:A6A8:2D33:EFD (talk) 01:12, 29 October 2022 (UTC)

Fixed. Thanks for pointing that out. Giants2008 (Talk) 18:17, 22 November 2022 (UTC)

In the introduction, please change 'As of 2022, Jordan's net worth is estimated at $1.7 billion' to 'As of 2023, Jordan's net worth is estimated at $1.7 billion'. SuspiciousPenguin2 (talk) 11:35, 16 February 2023 (UTC)

Done, both in the lead and the body. Giants2008 (Talk) 02:29, 22 February 2023 (UTC)

thx SuspiciousPenguin2 (talk) 06:54, 22 February 2023 (UTC)