Talk:Panathenaic Way/GA1

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Nominator: UndercoverClassicist (talk · contribs) 15:54, 11 April 2026 (UTC)

Reviewer: Elias Ziade (talk · contribs) 12:06, 23 April 2026 (UTC)

I will be reviewing this entry and providing feedback progressively.el.ziade (talkallam) 12:06, 23 April 2026 (UTC)

Thanks for taking this on, Elias Ziade. Looking forward to your thougths. UndercoverClassicist ^T·C 12:59, 23 April 2026 (UTC)

@UndercoverClassicist hey there, just letting you know that I am in the middle of the source review. el.ziade (talkallam) 13:00, 26 April 2026 (UTC)

Hi @UndercoverClassicist transferring my source review notes here shortly. Thanks for your patience. el.ziade (talkallam) 11:38, 1 May 2026 (UTC)

The romanised form of the name is not supported by Ficuciello 2008, p. 56 , do you have an alternative source for this?

This is a fair point: the Ficuciello citation wasn't supposed to support that, but I've added a note and an alternative citation to make that clear. UndercoverClassicist ^T·C 07:55, 2 May 2026 (UTC)

...in the northern wall of the Acropolis near the Klepsydra fountain Partially supported: neither cited source (Vanderpool 1949, p. 135; Ficuciello 2008, pp. 33–35) mentions the fountain on the cited pages, though it can be inferred from Ficuciello pp. 136 and 147 read alongside the map on p. 34.

I've added those extra pages just to be sure. UndercoverClassicist ^T·C 07:55, 2 May 2026 (UTC)

Course

Most of the road was constructed with a hard pebble surface... The Travlos source (Travlos 1981) runs pp. 391–407, the cited page 422 falls outside this range. Could you check the citation?
the Way entered the city at the Dipylon Gate The citation references p. 342 of Miles & Neils 2021, should this be p. 332?

By the late fifth century BCE, it continued southeast through the inner areas of the Kerameikos towards the Agora Same issue, p. 332 appears to be the correct reference page.

By the late fifth century BCE... The "late fifth century" dating could not be verified in the cited sources, could you point to where this is supported?

It's a necessary (and I think useful) inference from the topography we and the sources discuss -- for example, the Dipylon Gate was only built in 480/79, so it can hardly have continued from there any earlier. Similarly, the Agora itself was only laid out in the early C6th. We could adjust "late" somewhat, but I think it's helpful to put some sort of date here, since we've pointed out that parts of the route date back to the Neolithic, and the sources rely on readers assuming that "Athens" as they talk about it really refers to Athens in the C5th post Persian sack. UndercoverClassicist ^T·C 07:55, 2 May 2026 (UTC)

The overall route has a rise of 94 metres... Not corroborated in Travlos 1981, which as noted above ends at p. 407, the cited p. 422 is out of range.
Nitpicking: As with other roads connected to the city gates, the Way was repaired and widened... Minor: the source supports "widened" but does not mention repairs.

The bit for repairs is Roads leading to and from city gates seem to have received a more formal delineation in the second half of the fourth century, with extensive repair works and an increase in their width. UndercoverClassicist ^T·C 07:55, 2 May 2026 (UTC)

{green|During this period, a stone gutter was constructed along its southeast side.}} The source says southwest, not southeast. Can you please double check.

That was definitely the source I used, so I think it's just my mistake: changed. UndercoverClassicist ^T·C 07:55, 2 May 2026 (UTC)

In late antiquity...evidence of these operations is preserved in a drain used until the 580s The reference to Nees should point to note 24, not 14.

the article dates the Themistoclean Wall to "480/79 BCE" but the cited source describes it as built "rapidly after the devastation caused by the Persian invasion of Athens in 480/79" i.e. after the sack, can this be fixed?

I've added some additional refs here, which had the effect of moving the date by a year. UndercoverClassicist ^T·C 08:17, 2 May 2026 (UTC)

Structures and monuments

Also in note f: "The killers of the tyrant Hipparchos" :Hipparchos was not the tyrant; Hippias was. Consider "the killers of Hipparchos, brother of the tyrant Hippias." If i remember correctly, they were styled "tyrannicides" because later Athenian tradition reframed their act as one of liberation from tyranny.

It's a bit complicated, but they are generally treated as both being tyrants (Thucydides is a notable objector to this). See here, p. 12ff, which I'll add to the article. UndercoverClassicist ^T·C 08:17, 2 May 2026 (UTC)

Potential source conflict: Neils 1992, p. 20 appears to contradict Shear, stating that the location of the hippodrome is unknown and was likely "to the southwest of the city in the area now called New Phaleron", suggesting the equestrian contests may not have taken place along the Way itself, only the commemorative monuments.

These are two separate places: Athens did have a hippodrome (a dedicated building for horse/chariot racing), and did some equestrian events during the Panathenaia, at least for some of its history, along the Panathenaic Way. UndercoverClassicist ^T·C 08:23, 2 May 2026 (UTC)

The lead states initiates processed to the Dipylon; the body more precisely says the Sacred Gate adjacent to the Dipylon. Since these are distinct structures do you think this needs to be clarified in the lead?

As per MOS:WORDSASWORDS, it's best to Use italics when writing about words as words like in this passage The name "Panathenaic Way"[a] is known from an inscription, dating to the fourth century BCE --> The name Panathenaic Way is known from...
Please introduce[the classical archaeologist] John McK. Camp where first mentioned.
Julia L. Shear comments that the steepness and narrowness of parts of the road Please introduce Shear on first mention.
"86 BCE" is given twice in the Structures section : once for the stoas and once for the Pompeion.
Could date of formalisation be added to lead?

The inline period definitions are a very nice touch.
The width figures across the Course section (10 m, 20 m, ~29 m, 39–40 m) are scattered across separate paragraphs with no consolidating sentence summarising the overall trend of widening or am did i misread?

el.ziade (talkallam) 12:36, 1 May 2026 (UTC)

GA review