Talk:XMPP Standards Foundation

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I have just modified 2 external links on XMPP Standards Foundation. Please take a moment to review my edit. If you have any questions, or need the bot to ignore the links, or the page altogether, please visit this simple FaQ for additional information. I made the following changes:

• Added archive http://web.archive.org/web/20100201101518/http://xmpp.org:80/summit/summit1.shtml to http://xmpp.org/summit/summit1.shtml
• Added archive http://web.archive.org/web/20090127051940/http://xmpp.org:80/xsf/docs/bylaws.shtml to http://xmpp.org/xsf/docs/bylaws.shtml

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• What I think should be changed (include citations):

Suggested new introduction, to replace the current paragraph that exists on the original page prior to the 'history' heading:

The '''XMPP Standards Foundation''' ('''XSF''') is a non-profit organization that develops and maintains open standards for the [[XMPP|Extensible Messaging and Presence Protocol (XMPP)]], a decentralized, real-time communication protocol.<ref>{{cite web |title=XMPP Standards Foundation |url=https://xmpp.org/about/xmpp-standards-foundation/ |website=xmpp.org |access-date=2026-02-10}}</ref>

The foundation is responsible for stewarding the core XMPP specifications in coordination with the [[IETF|Internet Engineering Task Force (IETF)]] and for managing the XMPP Extension Protocol (XEP) process, which defines optional extensions to the protocol.<ref>{{cite web |title=XMPP Standards Process |url=https://xmpp.org/about/standards-process/ |website=xmpp.org |access-date=2026-02-10}}</ref>

The organization was founded in 2001 as the ''Jabber Software Foundation'' and was renamed the XMPP Standards Foundation in 2007 to reflect the protocol's standardization under the name XMPP.<ref>{{cite web |title=XSF Organizational Documents |url=https://xmpp.org/about/xsf/organizational-documents/ |website=xmpp.org |access-date=2026-02-10}}</ref><ref>{{cite web |title=Proposal: XMPP Standards Foundation |url=https://xmpp.org/about/xsf/records/proposals/xmpp-standards-foundation/ |website=xmpp.org |access-date=2026-02-10}}</ref>

• Why it should be changed:

1. Accurate description of responsibilities: The updated intro clarifies that the XSF manages both core XMPP specifications and the XEP process, rather than only providing general oversight.
2. Improved neutrality and clarity: The current introduction lacks precise citations. The revised version cites primary XSF sources to ensure verifiable and neutral statements.

• What I think should be changed (include citations):

Suggested new section 'Mission' to be positioned as first section on the page (prior to the 'history') section:

== Mission ==
The mission of the XMPP Standards Foundation is to build and promote an open, secure, interoperable, and decentralized infrastructure for real-time communication and collaboration on the Internet. The foundation focuses on protocol specifications rather than software implementations, and its standards are intended to be implementable without licensing fees.<ref>{{cite web |title=XSF Mission |url=https://xmpp.org/about/xsf/mission/ |website=xmpp.org |access-date=2026-02-10}}</ref>

• Why it should be changed:

1. Supports reader understanding: Including the mission in its own section makes the article consistent with Wikipedia standards for organization pages, which typically include a dedicated "Mission" or "Purpose" subsection.

• What I think should be changed (include citations):

Suggested new section to replace the preexisting 'XEPs section:

== Standards and specifications ==

=== Core XMPP specifications ===
The core XMPP protocol is standardized through the Internet Engineering Task Force, primarily in RFC 6120, RFC 6121, and RFC 6122, with subsequent updates and clarifications published over time.<ref>{{cite web |title=XMPP RFCs |url=https://xmpp.org/rfcs/ |website=xmpp.org |access-date=2026-02-10}}</ref>

=== XMPP Extension Protocols ===
In addition to the core protocol, the XSF maintains the '''XMPP Extension Protocol''' (XEP) series, which defines optional extensions that add functionality while preserving interoperability between implementations.<ref>{{cite web |title=XMPP Extension Protocols |url=https://xmpp.org/extensions/ |website=xmpp.org |access-date=2026-02-10}}</ref>

The XEP process is open and community-driven, allowing anyone to propose an extension. XEPs progress through defined maturity levels such as ''Experimental'', ''Draft'', ''Final'', or ''Deprecated'' under the oversight of the XMPP Council.<ref>{{cite web |title=XMPP Standards Process |url=https://xmpp.org/about/standards-process/ |website=xmpp.org |access-date=2026-02-10}}</ref>

• Why it should be changed:

1. Removes trivial and anecdotal content: The pronunciation discussion ("JEP" vs "ZEP") is informal, unsourced, and not encyclopedic.
2. Improves readability and structureL Replacing the unordered list of example XEPs with a description of the XEP system itself provides a clearer, concise explanation suitable for a general audience.

• What I think should be changed (include citations):

Suggested new section to replace the preexisting 'XMPP Summit section:

== Activities ==

=== Summits and events ===
The XMPP Standards Foundation organizes regular '''XMPP Summits''', typically held annually or biannually, where developers and community members meet to discuss protocol development and future directions.<ref>{{cite web |title=XMPP Summit 28 |url=https://xmpp.org/2025/11/xmpp-summit-28/ |website=xmpp.org |access-date=2026-02-10}}</ref>

=== Publications and outreach ===
The foundation publishes regular '''XMPP Newsletters''' summarizing technical developments, community projects, and ecosystem news, and participates in outreach related to open standards and decentralized communication.<ref>{{cite web |title=The XMPP Newsletter – December 2025 |url=https://xmpp.org/2026/01/the-xmpp-newsletter-december-2025/ |website=xmpp.org |access-date=2026-02-10}}</ref>

• Why it should be changed:

1. Updates frequency and scope: The previous section contains specific outdated dates and locations (e.g., FOSDEM, RealtimeConf, 2006), which may not longer reflect all current practices. The new section uses neutral language describing annual or biannual summits.
2. Improves neutrality: Removing promotional or overly detailed logistical information (e.g., "no costs attached," "open to donations") aligns with Wikipedia’s neutral tone guidelines.
3. Adds publications and outreach: Including XSF newsletters broadens the activities section, providing a more complete picture of XSF's engagement with the community.

Guusdk (talk) 13:49, 11 February 2026 (UTC)

• @Guusdk: First, thank you for following the process for COI edits! The challenge I have with your requests is that they are all supported by only primary sources from the XSF's website. The goal is for articles to primarily have secondary or tertiary sources that talk about the organization, rather than being from the organization. Can you find some reliable sources from, for instance, tech media sites, that talk about the XSF and it's work? For example, was there an article on some site talking about the latest XMPP Summit back in November? Ideally an article that talked about how this latest XMPP Summit was one in a long series of XMPP Summits, etc.

The key is that the article about the XSF is not a place to promote the XSF but rather a place to talk about the XSF - and so the sources need to be from places other than xmpp.org . If you can identify such sources, it would make it possible to do these kind of updates that you are suggesting here. - Dyork (talk) 16:13, 11 February 2026 (UTC)

Hi @Dyork, thank you for the (fair) feedback. It is correct that the edit relies on primary sources, which is not ideal. However, the article currently relies on the same type of sourcing, and this edit does not introduce a new issue in that regard. While it does not resolve the preexisting sourcing limitations, I do not believe it decreases the article's quality. In other respects, the edit improves the article, and on balance I believe it is an improvement over the prior version.

To address the usage of sources more specifically, would these sources be adequate?

IONOS article: https://www.ionos.com/digitalguide/server/know-how/xmpp/

This article describes XMPP as an open communication protocol that was standardized through the IETF and maintained/standardized with ongoing updates. It mentions that XMPP was developed by the Jabber community and became an IETF standard, and while it mentions the XSF's role in implementation and standardization indirectly, it is not focused on the organization.

Use cases in Wikipedia article (supported claims):

• Support introductory descriptive claim that XMPP is an open, extensible communication protocol standardized through IETF and used for real‑time messaging outside xmpp.org primary sources.
• Help frame a context paragraph on XMPP's history as a protocol independent of the XSF's own website (e.g., "XMPP, originally developed in 1998 and standardized by the IETF, forms the technical basis for the XSF's work.")

IETF XMPP working group page: https://datatracker.ietf.org/wg/xmpp/about/

This page is an independent confirmation that XMPP is standardized through the IETF working group process. It lists RFCs and working group activity separate from the XSF.

Use cases in Wikipedia article:

• Citation for the claim that XMPP core is standardized via the IETF and not solely internally maintained by the XSF (relevant in the 'Standards and Specifications' section).
• Supports the introductory notion of XMPP as a recognized global open standard with international community consensus beyond the XSF.

GetStream blog post: https://getstream.io/blog/xmpp-extensible-messaging-presence-protocol/

The GetStream blog post, while it is not focused on the XSF as an organization, does independently describe XMPP as an open, decentralized standard and identifies the XMPP Standards Foundation as the body responsible for maintaining and evolving the protocol.

Concretely, this source can support these sections of my proposed edit:

• The introduction paragraph describing XMPP as an open, standardized, decentralized real-time communication protocol and the XSF's role as its steward.
• The statement that XMPP is standardized via the IETF RFC process, providing independent confirmation of that relationship.
• Support high‑level statements about protocol extensibility and standards‑based design in 'Standards and Specifications' section.

FOSDEM 2025 technical program: https://fosdem.org/2025/schedule/event/fosdem-2025-5721-a-universal-and-stable-api-to-everything-xmpp/

A major open-source conference listing a talk that explicitly explains how XSF is organized and how XMPP specifications are created, including mentioning XEPs. This is an independent program description from the conference website.

Use cases in Wikipedia article:

• Independent verification that the XSF organizational and standards process is discussed at a major open‑source conference, supporting notability and factual claims about the XSF's role in standards.
• Can be cited in 'Activities' or 'Standards and Specifications' to show recognition of the XSF's work outside its own site.

FOSDEM 2026 session description: https://fosdem.org/2026/schedule/event/7XJL9E-engineering_xmpp_federation_building_messaging_voice_social_features_across_inde/

This source shows that XMPP and the ecosystem around the XSF appear in independent technical contexts, and the session describes how the XSF interacts with implementations. It directly talks about the XSF's work on specifications and ecosystem collaboration.

Use cases in Wikipedia article:

• Supports for claims that the XSF's work is recognized and discussed in major forums beyond xmpp.org, lending weight to the Foundation's real‑world relevance.
• Use in 'Activities' or 'Standards' to note real‑world implementation/ecosystem involvement beyond internal documents.

IgniteRealtime blog post: https://discourse.igniterealtime.org/t/igniterealtime-heads-to-brussels-xsf-summit-fosdem-2026/96325

Although this comes from a community site rather than xmpp.org, it is not published by the XSF itself and therefore functions as a secondary mention of XSF activity outside of the organization's own website.

• In the 'Summits and Events' section, the blog post confirms that the XSF Summit is a recurring gathering where developers, maintainers and contributors across the XMPP ecosystem come together, and that the event is organized by the XMPP Standards Foundation. This provides confirmation of the existence and continuity of these summits.

I should note that I am also the author of the Ignite Realtime blog post. Because of that, I agree it shouldn't be treated as a fully independent secondary source on its own. I'm proposing it only as supplementary confirmation of factual details.

ProcessOne blog post: https://www.process-one.net/blog/supporting-xmpp-standard-foundations-open-letter-to-meta-for-true-interop/

This blog post covers an open letter issued by the XSF calling on Meta to adopt XMPP for interoperability. It is independent reporting of an XSF action and thus counts as third‑party coverage of an organizational initiative.

Use cases in Wikipedia article:

• Independent confirmation that the XSF publishes actions of public interest (e.g., advocacy on interoperability).
• Supports a sentence in 'Activities' about the XSF engaging with broader technical community and public dialogue.
• Helps show that XSF isn't only internally documented but that third‑party blogs report on its initiatives.

Guusdk (talk) 11:22, 13 February 2026 (UTC)

@Guusdk: Thanks for all of that. It's a good start. I'll see if I have some time to work on it in the weeks ahead. (Obviously other editors may do so as well!) - Dyork (talk) 20:30, 13 February 2026 (UTC)