Wikipedia:Featured article candidates/Nile/archive1

HurricaneZeta

First thing I noticed is that the lead image is grainy. Is there a better image to put in the lead? It's also not particularly representative - the one for Amazon River is a high-quality satellite image so something similar would be better in my opinion. HurricaneZeta^C 22:38, 19 March 2026 (UTC)

I'll look for a less grainy photo. I avoided satellite images in the InfoBox because the article body text already has lots of "birds eye view" images/maps and they were getting repetitive. There are 100's of images in Commons, I should be able to find a better one. Noleander (talk) 22:42, 19 March 2026 (UTC)

I replaced the InfoBox image with this Commons image, which is 3k x 2k pixels. I tried a satellite image, but they all look really ugly in the InfoBox because the Nile satellite pics are generally very tall & skinny images (because the river runs N-S). The Amazon is different: the Amazon basin's rectangular outline is a nice 3x2 (wider than tall) so is great for an InfoBox. I could crop a Nile sat image to show only the delta, but the article already has plenty of images & text about Egypt (rightfully so) but I think the InfoBox is a good place to remind readers that the Nile goes way beyond Egypt and is green & lush in most of the southern half. Noleander (talk) 22:52, 19 March 2026 (UTC)

The image certainly looks good! A nitpick tho: "The beauty of river nile, as you progress towards Murchison falls" for the image's description on Commons doesn't actually describe the image. Icepinner (Come to Hakurei Shrine!) 14:08, 20 March 2026 (UTC)

Thanks for pointing that out. I improved the image description in Commons so it now says "A view of Murchison Falls on the Nile River, looking east. This portion of the Nile in Uganda, between Lake Victoria and Lake Albert, is called the Victoria Nile". Also: Thanks for your great comments in the Peer Review, much appreciated. Noleander (talk) 14:53, 20 March 2026 (UTC)

I rather disagree with this new choice of image; I think we should seek an image that better represents the Nile across its full course, and (as infobox photos are primarily for identification), fits with what people would expect the Nile to be. I searched through Commons and found some possible candidates:

• Commons:File:River Nile at Karima (3) (33706717470).jpg

I think this gets across the pure size of the river well, it's very well-composed, and it shows a fairly typical riverside environment

• Commons:File:Nile Cataracts 03.jpg

The 1st Cataract is one of the most important spots on the river, and this is a good wide view that shows both the size of the river and its importance to human settlement

• Commons:File:Nile in Luxor.jpg

Similar to the former, but with better resolution, albeit not at quite as important a location

I think any of these would be nice. (And again, thank you so much for your work on this article!) Generalissima (talk) (it/she) 05:58, 21 March 2026 (UTC)

@Generalissima - Thanks for the feedback on the InfoBox image. Those three images you found are okay, but the sky seems a bit overcast & hazy in all three. Unfortunately, Wiki Commons does not have many nice pictures of the Nile that are hi-res, and capture the essence of the Nile, and have good composition. I've put together this image gallery of about 11 images (including the 3 you provided, and the current image, and the one that was in the InfoBox before that). Can you glance at that gallery and see if any of the other ones are satisfactory? Noleander (talk) 15:15, 21 March 2026 (UTC)

The_Nile_River_flows_into_the_Mediterranean_Sea_(iss071e405499).jpg, Nil 25.jpg would work well if we want to go for a satellite picture. I searched through Flickr, and was able to find one more that might be useable (though I think we'd want to crop to the left side of the picture for an infobox image); Commons:File:Nile 3rd Cataract Sudan pano.jpg Generalissima (talk) (it/she) 15:33, 21 March 2026 (UTC)

Oh, I'm liking Commons:File:Nile 3rd Cataract Sudan pano.jpg ... I'll crop that and upload the cropped version to Commons (I have not yet found a way to perform cropping within the confines of the InfoBox parameters). I'll put it into the InfoBox soon. Noleander (talk) 15:44, 21 March 2026 (UTC)

I made three cropped versions of the Flickr image ... left, middle, and right. I put them into User:Noleander/sandboxNile so you can see all three. I picked one at random and put it into the Nile InfoBox. Let me know which one you think is best. Noleander (talk) 16:22, 21 March 2026 (UTC)

I really like File:The Nile River flows into the Mediterranean Sea (iss071e405499).jpg for a satellite image. I think the one in the infobox now is the best option for a ground view, though HurricaneZeta^C 17:57, 21 March 2026 (UTC)

There's still room in the article for more images ... so both could be included. The satellite image might be tricky in the InfoBox because a lengthy caption might be required to distinguish the Nile from the Red Sea (for readers who are not savvy about geography) e.g. "The Nile river (the dark, narrow, horizontal, meandering line in the bottom portion of the image)" Noleander (talk) 18:25, 21 March 2026 (UTC)

I put that satellite image into the article at Nile#Prehistory. Noleander (talk) 18:31, 21 March 2026 (UTC)

MSincccc - support

• Thanks for bringing yet another vital article to FAC. I will be leaving comments shortly. MSincccc (talk) 03:57, 20 March 2026 (UTC)

Lead

• None here, except a few places in the article where I spotted double spaces. MSincccc (talk) 05:19, 20 March 2026 (UTC)

Names and etymology

• "The English name of the Blue Nile" → "The English name 'Blue Nile'"

Done. Although I used double quotes per MOS:WORDSASWORDS, because the article is using italics for foreign words; single quotes for English gloss of foreign words; double quotes for words-as-words. Noleander (talk) 15:03, 20 March 2026 (UTC)

• You could link to Lake Victoria, Lake Kyoga and Lake Albert (Africa) on first mention in the body.

Done. Noleander (talk) 15:03, 20 March 2026 (UTC)

• "as they carried sediment from upriver" → "as they carry sediment from upriver"

Done. Noleander (talk) 15:03, 20 March 2026 (UTC)

• downstream from confluence of Blue Nile and White Nile - "the confluence"?

Done. Noleander (talk) 15:03, 20 March 2026 (UTC)

MSincccc (talk) 05:19, 20 March 2026 (UTC)

Geography

• "the course from there to Lake Albert" → "the stretch from there ..." More idiomatic in this context?

Done. Noleander (talk) 17:08, 21 March 2026 (UTC)

• "a tributary flowing from the west" → "a tributary from the west"

Done. Noleander (talk) 17:08, 21 March 2026 (UTC)

• "This confluence happens in Lake No." - How about "occurs" in place of "happens"?

Done. Noleander (talk) 17:08, 21 March 2026 (UTC)

• Where the White Nile merges with the Blue Nile they are noticeably distinct colors. - You could insert a comma before "they are".

Done. Not 100% sure it is better, but it is not worse. Noleander (talk) 17:08, 21 March 2026 (UTC)

• "second largest" → "second-largest"

Done. Noleander (talk) 17:08, 21 March 2026 (UTC)

• "which then follows a large S-shape curve" → "which then follows a large S-shaped curve"

Done. Noleander (talk) 17:08, 21 March 2026 (UTC)

MSincccc (talk) 14:59, 21 March 2026 (UTC)

Sources

• The source of the Blue Nile tributary is near the town of Gish Abay, south of Lake Tana. - How about merging it into any of the previous paragraphs since it is only a single sentence?

That section identifies five distinct sources: one per paragraph. Merging two paragraphs would make it harder for readers to grasp the the sources are all separate. Noleander (talk) 17:19, 21 March 2026 (UTC)

• The distance was determined from satellite imagery, and was measured
  • Could we avoid mentioning "was" twice?

Done. Noleander (talk) 17:19, 21 March 2026 (UTC)

• "than its inflowing rivers" → "than its tributaries"

Changed to ... than the rivers that flow into the lake. I just looked up the definition of "tributary", and you are correct, it can mean rivers flowing into a lake. But I've never seen it used that way before (I've only seen it used to mean a smaller river that flows into a larger river). So, I'm reluctant to employ that (apparently) rare usage. Google says "influent" would work, but that is a super rare word. Let me know if the new blue text is not satisfactory. Noleander (talk) 17:19, 21 March 2026 (UTC)

MSincccc (talk) 16:48, 21 March 2026 (UTC)

Hydrology

• The waters of the Blue Nile are so substantial during the summer and autumn, that the White Nile backs-up during this time at the confluence. - Both British and American English would use "backs up". Also, you could drop after "autumn".

Done. Noleander (talk) 14:04, 22 March 2026 (UTC)

Ecology

• industrial pollutants and sewage; ships contribute pollutants to the waters; - You could avoid repeating "pollutants" in close proximity.

Done. Noleander (talk) 14:04, 22 March 2026 (UTC)

• These arid conditions led to famines and social disruption, and also to increased environmental degradation. - You could drop "also to".

Done. Noleander (talk) 14:04, 22 March 2026 (UTC)

• "increase in frequency and severity of both dryness and drought" → "increase in the frequency and severity of droughts"

Done. Noleander (talk) 14:04, 22 March 2026 (UTC)

MSincccc (talk) 05:12, 22 March 2026 (UTC)

Geography

• The article uses both "Bahr al Ghazal" and "Bahr el Ghazal" - how about using only one?
• "eventually producing the current river" → "eventually producing the current form of the river" - clearer?
• "rivers in Ethiopian and Ugandan highlands" → "rivers in the Ethiopian and Ugandan highlands" -adds the missing article
• where the modern Lake Albert and Lake Edwards are. - Isn't it "Lake Edward" or am I mistaken?
• "the Sea completely evaporated" → "the sea completely evaporated"
• After the Strait of Gibraltar reopened, the Sea refilled- same as the previous suggestion
• "Lake Victoria roughly assumed its modern shape" → "Lake Victoria assumed roughly its modern shape"
• "tilted northwards" → "tilted northward"

Done ... all of the above. Noleander (talk) 23:47, 22 March 2026 (UTC)

MSincccc (talk) 16:33, 22 March 2026 (UTC)

Geological history

• "and start forming Lake Victoria" → "and to start forming Lake Victoria"

Human history

• "the Egyptian's need" → "the Egyptians' need"
• "also were within its realm" → "were also within its realm"
• "between 1613 to 1618" → "between 1613 and 1618"
• “the furthermost source” → “the farthest source” - more idiomatic?

MSincccc (talk) 04:49, 23 March 2026 (UTC)

Water politics in the modern era

• "water projects to enhance the production of the cotton industry" → "water projects to enhance cotton production"
• "an agreement between Egypt and Anglo-Egyptian Sudan was formed" → "an agreement between Egypt and Anglo-Egyptian Sudan was reached"

- more idiomatic?

• "dialog" →"dialogue"
• quality of life of their populace - How about using "population" in place of "populace"?
• "kilowatt hours" → "kilowatt-hours"
• Is there any way water politics could be linked in this section? No worries if not.

Did all of the above except one: Did not add a link to water politics. I searched and could not find a decent place to put it. The Nile#Water politics in the modern era section already begins with a "further" template that directs the reader to Water politics in the Nile Basin, which should satisfy the same goal. Noleander (talk) 17:44, 23 March 2026 (UTC)

MSincccc (talk) 16:59, 23 March 2026 (UTC)

General

• You could also briefly mention that the Nile is a transboundary river.

Economy (Agriculture)

• "primarily" → "mainly" - More common in American English.
• Much of the irrigated land is within the Gezira Scheme, an extensive irrigation project initiated in the 1920s -How about "started" in place of "initiated" for simplicity?
• The primary crops in Sudan are peanuts, cotton, sesame, sugarcane, and sorghum. -You could link to some of the crops.
• and Khashm Al-Qirbah Dam- Is this the same as Khashm el-Girba Dam?

Economy (Fisheries)

• "which is more than half of the total fresh water yield from the entire African continent" → "which is more than half of the total freshwater yield from all of Africa"- More idiomatic?
• "Fish farming is performed at some places in the basin" → "Fish farming is carried out in some parts of the basin"- More idiomatic?

Did all of the preceding items except: Kept "primarily" (vs "mainly"); and kept "from ... the African continent" because that particular usage is emphasizing fish caught in freshwater lakes (inside the continent) and excludes ocean fishing. Noleander (talk) 14:19, 24 March 2026 (UTC)

MSincccc (talk) 09:14, 24 March 2026 (UTC)

Economy (Hydropower)

• "Nile River, but thereafter" → "Nile River, but thereafter,"

Economy (Transportation)

• None here.

Economy (Tourism and recreation)

• The Bandingilo National Park, near the White Nile, is in South Sudan.- This has already been mentioned in the previous sentence (South Sudan has the Boma National Park, Bandingilo National Park).

Did the items above. Noleander (talk) 17:32, 24 March 2026 (UTC)

MSincccc (talk) 16:45, 24 March 2026 (UTC)

In culture (Art and literature)

• None

In culture (Myth and religion)

• You could link to cosmology and more specifically to Ancient Egyptian religion#Cosmology, if it is possible to do so.

Done. Noleander (talk) 18:01, 25 March 2026 (UTC)

• Isis was a major deity in the Egyptian religion who was strongly associated with the Nile River.- You could avoid "was" twice in the same sentence.

Done. Noleander (talk) 18:01, 25 March 2026 (UTC)

*"dated to first century BCE" → "dated to the first century BCE"

Thanks for doing that one. Noleander (talk) 18:01, 25 March 2026 (UTC)

MSincccc (talk) 04:57, 25 March 2026 (UTC)

Bottom line

• That's all from me. Thank you again for the article.

MSincccc (talk) 14:11, 25 March 2026 (UTC)

@MSincccc: - Thank-you very much for your assistance: it tremendously improved the article. Noleander (talk)

Thank you. Good luck with the nomination; I’ll keep an eye on it in case anything else comes up. I will support it. MSincccc (talk) 03:36, 26 March 2026 (UTC)

Water politics in the modern era (Post-colonial era)

• Egypt built the Aswan High Dam (completed 1970);...In 1960, Egypt started building the Aswan High Dam (completed in 1970) - Two consecutive paragraphs mention that the Dam was completed in 1970. You could drop it in one of the sentences. MSincccc (talk) 16:28, 28 March 2026 (UTC)

Done. Noleander (talk) 17:00, 28 March 2026 (UTC)

Prose

• "Sennar Dam" has been linked on four out of five mentions in the article text. It could be delinked on one of the mentions. MSincccc (talk) 16:34, 1 April 2026 (UTC)

Done. Eliminated all links but one (plus the link inside the River Route map, which is an independent template). Noleander (talk) 17:16, 1 April 2026 (UTC)

I noticed eleven links to Grand Ethiopian Renaissance Dam (including footnotes); perhaps a few could be delinked per MOS:OL? MSincccc (talk) 15:09, 9 April 2026 (UTC)

Done. Thanks for pointing that out - I've removed 3 links from the body text (tho each was in a unique top-level section, which is permitted by MOS). I've left links that are in (a) footnotes; (b) tables; and (c) image captions - since readers sometimes read those in a "stand alone" manner and so links may be useful in those contexts. Noleander (talk) 16:44, 9 April 2026 (UTC)

Thanks for your response.

I also noticed both ‘Ancient Egyptian’ and ‘ancient Egyptian’ in the article body. Would it be worth standardising, or is there a reason for the variation? MSincccc (talk) 16:29, 10 April 2026 (UTC)

I think the article is capitalizing "ancient" correctly: "Ancient Egypt" is a proper noun that identifies a specific civilization, so the article capitalizes "... Ancient Egypt civilization". Lower case is used in other situations such as "ancient Egyptian art" or "ancient Egyptian boats", were "ancient" is an adjective specifying the age of the following (non-proper) noun. I'm not 100% it is correct grammatically, but at least it is consistent. Noleander (talk) 17:27, 10 April 2026 (UTC)

Economy

• along a narrow strip along the river banks
  • Could the repetition of "along" be avoided? MSincccc (talk) 12:39, 2 April 2026 (UTC)

@Noleander Thoughts? MSincccc (talk) 17:05, 4 April 2026 (UTC)

Ah, thanks for the nudge. Done: Changed to ... are concentrated in a narrow strip along riverbanks with ample transportation opportunities. Noleander (talk) 01:23, 5 April 2026 (UTC)

The first sentence

• I was contemplating whether or not to directly link to Northeast Africa in The Nile is a major north-flowing river in northeast Africa which empties into the Mediterranean Sea. I look forward to your thoughts. MSincccc (talk) 16:50, 7 April 2026 (UTC)

@Noleander I look forward to your thoughts on this when you have a moment. MSincccc (talk) 13:22, 8 April 2026 (UTC)

Thanks for suggesting the link to Northeast Africa. That Northeast Africa article is not great: (a) it is rather tiny; and (b) there is no link to Africa anywhere in the article. Also there is the question of how "northeast" is used: in "... river in northeast Africa .." the word "northeast" is being used as an adjective (specifying a portion of Africa), and not as a proper noun naming an official political/geographic region (which would be capitalized as Northeast Africa). But if you think the link should be changed, we can do that. Noleander (talk) 13:52, 8 April 2026 (UTC)

• Hi MSincccc, I was wondering if you felt in a position to either support or oppose this nomination? Obviously, neither is obligatory. Thanks. Gog the Mild (talk) 18:15, 26 April 2026 (UTC)

  @Gog the Mild I declared my support in this revision. It seems to have gone up due to my returning with more comments later. Best, MSincccc (talk) 18:27, 26 April 2026 (UTC)

I missed it. Thanks. Gog the Mild (talk) 18:31, 26 April 2026 (UTC)

UC

A very quick one for now:

• the Arabic word النيل (romanized as 'Nil'): the Arabic has the definite article on it: it's pronounced "an-Nil". UndercoverClassicist ^T·C 08:05, 21 March 2026 (UTC)

@UndercoverClassicist - Thanks for the feedback! I changed the article to In Egypt, its names use the Arabic word النيل (romanized as 'An Nil') in the forms Al-Nīl, Baḥr Al-Nīl or Nahr Al-Nīl. I got the Arabic spelling from the Badawi source. The Hurst source lists the three forms at the end of the sentence, which all start with "Al". So, there is a now a mixture of "Al" and "An". Is that a problem? Would it be simpler to remove the definite article from the Arabic? Noleander (talk) 15:32, 21 March 2026 (UTC)

Out of my expertise, I'm afraid -- I think you'd be wise to consult someone who speaks Egyptian Arabic! From what I can tell, the "proper" transcription is always "al-Nil" etc, but Arabic speakers would assimilate the l to the n because n is a "sun letter". So it's pronounced "an-Nil" in all of these contexts, but may be written in Romanisation as "al-", (I would guess) particularly in proper nouns where the Romanisation may be more conservative. Compare El Alamein, which reflects the Egpytian pronounciation even though the article remains "Al" in "proper" transcription. UndercoverClassicist ^T·C 16:27, 21 March 2026 (UTC)

Alright, thanks for the insightful information. I'll figure out a sensible path forward. Noleander (talk) 16:31, 21 March 2026 (UTC)

I changed it to follow the Harold Edwin Hurst source: I removed the Arabic spelling, and left the three romanized versions; thus avoiding the definite article issue altogether. Noleander (talk) 17:26, 21 March 2026 (UTC)

From Tim riley

Drive-by – or perhaps in this case barge-by – comment: the article is mostly written in American but an English spelling has crept in with "500 metres". I'll look in again if time permits, but it's a very long article – 10,000 words! Tim riley talk 14:40, 21 March 2026 (UTC)

@Tim riley - Thanks for catching the spelling issue; I have fixed it. Article size: It was up to 11,000 words, but I struggled mightily to get it down to 10,000. It is the longest river in the world, after all :-) And a Level 3 Vital Article. Any additional feedback you can provide on the article would be appreciated. Noleander (talk) 15:36, 21 March 2026 (UTC)

@Tim riley - FYI, I've trimmed the article - now down to 9,572 words. Noleander (talk) 02:40, 23 March 2026 (UTC)

Andrew Davidson

Airship

As always, these are suggestions, not demands; feel free to refuse with justification.

General

• the capitalisation of "basin" is inconsistent throughout the article, especially when following "Nile"

Done. Sources are split on whether to capitalize the "B", so I flipped a coin and went with capital "B". Noleander (talk) 13:49, 25 March 2026 (UTC)

• I'm surprised that with the superfluity of available sources, Britannica still has to be cited? Especially with the confusing citation Harold Edwin Hurst, 2025...

Regarding Harold Edwin Hurst: he was the world's foremost Nile expert in the 20th century, and his works are still cited by Nile academics in the 21st century. He was the original author of the Britannica article – which lends some weight to that article. Although he has been dead for 48 years, so some of the Britannica 's "Nile" article has probably been re-written by the co-authors.

Reliability: I used Britannica as a source reluctantly, and only as a last resort. Britannica often states basic facts about the Nile that secondary sources do not state because they are so "obvious". Britannica is used in this article only to support non-contentious material.

Regarding the number of citations to the Hurst article: the Nile#Geography section this article adopted Hurst's division of the Nile Basin into seven regions. So, the article necessarily cites him once or twice for each of the seven regions of the Basin, which quickly put the number of cites over ten. Noleander (talk) 14:24, 25 March 2026 (UTC)

• There are 2,500 words of footnotes, which seems excessive.

Agree. I just reduced the footnotes from 2,625 words to 1,785 words (using Google Doc word counter). There were a large number of footnotes because a couple of months ago the article grew to 11,000 prose words, and when I trimmed the article down to 9,500 words, most of that trimmed material was pushed into footnotes. The remaining footnotes are significant; but I can remove more, if necessary. Noleander (talk) 14:51, 25 March 2026 (UTC)

Lead and infobox

• Think it would be useful to have a map in the infobox? Something like File:Nile basin map.png?

I added that map to the InfoBox so we could assess it. The InfoBox had a map when I started working on the article several months ago, but I removed it because (a) it caused the InfoBox to be so tall it encroached on the following section; and (b) there were already five maps in the article body. In my opinion, a map (still) makes the InfoBox too tall and ugly. Upon further review: the tributary labels in that map are very helpful. The map is back in there now: let me know what you think. Noleander (talk) 15:36, 25 March 2026 (UTC)

• Why are those five cities in particular cited as "major"?

Three are national capitals: Cairo, Khartoum, and Juba. Those three cites are from the northern desert part of the Nile. The other two were selected to give representation to the southern highlands (in other words, I didn't want the InfoBox to be "desert centric"). Both are historically significant for the Nile: Bahir Dar is near the source of the Blue Nile; and Jinja is near one of the sources of the White Nile. The latter two could be removed if needed. Noleander (talk) 15:36, 25 March 2026 (UTC)

• "although the Blue Nile contributes over two thirds of the water and silt below the confluence of the two" is a bit clunky, especially towards the end. Good to simplify, especially in the lead. I'd say simply that Blue Nile contributes over twice the volume as the White Nile.

Done. Changed to The White Nile is longer and is considered to be the headwaters, yet the Blue Nile contributes over twice the volume as the White Nile. Noleander (talk) 18:06, 25 March 2026 (UTC)

• "and has followed its present course for about 12,000 years" this doesn't seem to be mentioned/cited in the body

Done. Added a new sentence to body text explicitly stating the most authoritative value (15,000 years); and updated lead to match (15,000). The 12,000 figure is mentioned by one or two sources, but 15,000 has more weight in the sources. Noleander (talk) 18:15, 25 March 2026 (UTC)

• "Other countries in the Nile Basin are..." the general implication is that all of these countries are fully in the basin.

Done. Changed to Other countries that lie wholly or partly in the Nile Basin are Burundi, ... Noleander (talk) 18:19, 25 March 2026 (UTC)

• The balance of the paragraph on human history seems off. As seen from Andrew Davidson's helpful {{section sizes}} addition on the talk page, the subsections of #Human history are roughly equal on prose size. But in the lead, we have five sentences relating to Ancient Egypt, and then "Nubian, Ethiopian, and Nilotic cultures" and "Egypt from Roman era to colonial era" are completely skipped until one sentence of "Search for the source of the Nile".

Done. Changed that paragraph in the lead to:

The Nile was the foundation of the Ancient Egyptian civilization, which relied on the river for nearly every aspect of life. The annual flooding of the river deposited nutrient-rich silt along the riverbanks. This soil supported crops that enabled a sophisticated society to thrive in an otherwise inhospitable desert. The Nile facilitated trade, communication, transportation, and governance. South of the second Nile cataract lies Nubia, the historical home of the ancient Kerma culture and the Kushite Empire. Many Europeans were fascinated by the Nile, and their explorations around Lake Victoria in the late 19th century located the source of the river. Among the cultures that live along the Nile in the modern era are the the Nilotic peoples, semi-nomadic cattle herders who practice nomadic pastoralism, moving their cattle seasonally in response to the Nile's floods.

Noleander (talk) 18:43, 25 March 2026 (UTC)

Excellent work. ~~ AirshipJungleman29 (talk) 09:46, 26 March 2026 (UTC)

• "the Nile plays a critical role in the economy of countries in the Nile basin" is anyone expecting it to play a critical role for countries outside the basin?

Done. Changed to In the modern era, the Nile plays a critical role in the economies of Egypt and Sudan, which rely on it to irrigate ... Noleander (talk) 18:45, 25 March 2026 (UTC)

Names and etymology

All good here.

Geography

• Is this section the "Geography of the Nile" or the "Geography of the Nile Basin"? Are they the same thing?

That is an excellent question. This article mimics the sources, which generally conflate the Nile River and Nile Basin. I believe that sources avoid separating the basin from the river because such an effort would lead to confusion & contradictions. From a hydrological point of view: any drop of water that falls within the Nile Basin will roll downhill and end up in a tributary of the Nile, then the Nile River itself (ignoring evaporation & seeping into the ground). The only times sources sharply separate the river from the basin is when dealing with human cultures: if a culture is within the basin, but does/did not interact with the Nile or one of its tributaries, then the sources will exclude that culture from a river-oriented discussion. This article follows suit, and only mentions cultures that had significant interaction with the river. Noleander (talk) 18:54, 25 March 2026 (UTC)

• Shahin 2002 p.272 notes that the basin is one-tenth the surface area of Africa, which seems a good comparison to include for general readers who might appreciate a sense of scale more than a very big number.

Done. Noleander (talk) 19:05, 25 March 2026 (UTC)

• The map I mentioned above seems to label the different portions of the Nile (Victoria/Mountain etc.) in a way the current one in the section doesn't. Might be more helpful for readers. The current map doesn't help with understanding the sequence.

That's a good point: those labels are very helpful for readers. Definitely a strong argument in favor of keeping that new map in the InfoBox, in spite of the fact that the map makes the InfoBox rather tall. Noleander (talk) 19:05, 25 March 2026 (UTC)

• "Unlike Lake Victoria, Lake Albert is a deep lake surrounded by mountains." is Lake Victoria not surrounded by mountains?

That statement is paraphrasing one of the sources. Lake Victoria is surrounded by rolling hills. The mountains are farther west, on the west edge of the East African Rift, along the string of lakes: Lake Tanganyika, Lake Kivu, Lake Edward, and Lake Albert. Noleander (talk) 19:11, 25 March 2026 (UTC)

• Is the Albert Nile the same as the Mountain Nile? What's the difference between the two?

Done. Clarified the definitions as follows:

• Albert Nile – Segment of the White Nile flowing north from Lake Albert to Nimule
• Mountain Nile – Segment of the White Nile from the mountains of Uganda to the plains of South Sudan

The Albert Nile is a very short segment. The sources do not make clear whether the Mountain Nile includes the Albert Nile. Noleander (talk) 19:32, 25 March 2026 (UTC)

• "At the downstream edge of the Sudd swamp, the Nile is joined by the Bahr el Ghazal River (Arabic: 'gazelle river') a tributary from the west. This confluence occurs in Lake No." so is the Sudd swamp identical to Lake No?

Done. The Sudd swamp is huge; Lake No is a small lake at the north end of the swamp. Improved the wording to "At the north edge of the Sudd swamp, the Nile passes through Lake No, a small lake where the Nile is joined by the Bahr el Ghazal River (Arabic: 'gazelle river') – a tributary from the west." Noleander (talk) 19:44, 25 March 2026 (UTC)

• "it reaches into the Mediterranean Sea to a depth of 1,800 meters (5,900 ft)" do we know how far offshore this is?

I have removed that "... depth of 1,800 meters... " sentence from the article ...the cited sources do not state that fact; and I've gone through my notes and cannot find the source. I've found some new sources that cover the material (with different values), but given the size of the article, it is probably best to simply remove it. Let me know if you want similar material from new sources ... I can add it. Noleander (talk) 20:17, 25 March 2026 (UTC)

• "The final two regions of the Nile Basin are drainage basins of two tributaries: the Blue Nile basin and the Atbarah River basin." this is followed by a section on the drainage basins of four tributaries, including one whose drainage basin is larger than that of the Blue Nile and Atbarah combined...

Done. I re-organized the entire "Geography" section so the material is clearer. The seven regions of the Nile basin now map directly to the seven subsections. And the tributaries are embedded within the appropriate region section. The confusing "Tributaries" section title is now gone. Noleander (talk) 20:41, 25 March 2026 (UTC)

Perhaps the description of the Bahr el Ghazal tributary would better fit in "Mountain Nile", where it is first introduced? ~~ AirshipJungleman29 (talk) 09:52, 26 March 2026 (UTC)

Done. Thanks for pointing out that mistake. Noleander (talk) 14:36, 26 March 2026 (UTC)

Sources

• A little odd that this doesn't come before the discussion of the general Nile geography, which seems more logical.

Done. Moved Sources section above Geography section. Noleander (talk) 20:22, 25 March 2026 (UTC)

• Also odd that the true location of the source of the Nile isn't discussed at all!

I'll carefully review that reliable source :-) Noleander (talk) 20:22, 25 March 2026 (UTC)

Hydrology

• The second paragraph seems repetitive.

Done. Noleander (talk) 21:19, 25 March 2026 (UTC)

• "The White Nile passes through the Sudd swamps before it reaches the Blue Nile; about half the water flowing into the Sudd is lost to evaporation before it flows out" again, this seems like it could be more concise

Done. Changed to As the White Nile passes through the Sudd swamps about half the water is lost to evaporation. Noleander (talk) 21:19, 25 March 2026 (UTC)

• "that the White Nile backs up during this time at the confluence" does this mean it flows in reverse, or just stays still, or what?

The sources are not clear about that. If I had to guess: the rate-of-flow slows to near zero, and the water level in the swamp rises (but the water does not flow backwards). Noleander (talk)

• I am not sure about the "Water sources and sinks" subsection. What additional information am I meant to be getting from the tables that I would not get from a simple list of countries/stations and whether they are a source or a sink? Especially considering that every table has the disclaimer "Data does not include impacts of the Grand Ethiopian Renaissance Dam, completed in 2025", which seems to amount to "everything may be wrong now".

The water balance information is critical for two reasons:

1. Many hard-science sources talk about the hydrology data at great length; and
2. The hydrology tables illustrate the water scarcity issues in the Nile Basin. Some experts predict that the basin population may nearly double in the 21st century; and if a long-term drought were to afflict Ethiopia, it could lead to famine and international violence. (See, e.g., Bunbury 2023 pp 43-44,61,70).

For those reasons, the Nile article is obligated to present the statistics. To display the information, choices include (in order of increasing verbosity):

a) No tables; use simple prose

b) No tables; use lists (perhaps bullet lists)

c) Tables: collapse some, un-collapse others

d) Tables: un-collapse all

In my judgement, (a) is not true to the sources, nor to the gravity of the information. (d) is not bad, but might be overwhelming to lay readers. So that leaves (b) or (c), both of which use roughly the same amount of vertical real estate. Tables (c) are 100x more flexible than lists (b), and will enable the article to evolve and grow in the future decades. So, the article is using (c) now.

Regarding the fact that the GERD dam was just completed in 2025: If anything, that makes the tabular data even more important. Consider this scenario: the year is 2050, a drought has hit North Africa, and the GERD reservoir level is falling. Water discharge from the dam is far below normal, and crops in Sudan and Egypt are failing due to lack of irrigation. The future editors of WP will want to update the Nile article to show the historical changes to the the flow of the river: How much water reached Egypt annually in 2020 (when they stared filling the GERD reservoir)? How much reached Egypt in 2025 (GERD filled)? How much in 2030? 2040? How much after a drought had been going on for 5 years? 10 years? These future WP editors will probably evolve the tables to look like this:

More information Country, Water balance 2020 ...

Hydrology table may expand to look like this:

Country	Water balance 2020	Water balance 2030	Water balance 2040
Ethiopia	1111	222	333
... more countries ...	888	000	999
Egypt	333	444	555
Sudan	6666	7777	3333

Close

The hydrology tables in today's Nile article are the baseline for this important information.

In summary, the scientific sources (as opposed to the cultural sources) heavily cover the hydrology statistics; and a tabular layout is essential to presenting the information in an organized fashion. As the 21st century unfolds, the tables can evolve to display essential water scarcity data. Noleander (talk) 22:00, 25 March 2026 (UTC)

Alright, an argument from coverage in the sources is the best way to establish WP:DUEWEIGHT, so I can accept that. ~~ AirshipJungleman29 (talk) 10:01, 26 March 2026 (UTC)

Ecology

• "There are 36 industries that discharge their pollution sources directly into the Nile, and 41 into irrigation canals." do the groups overlap or are they separate?

Unknown. The source is a 2005 report by the Nile Basin Initiative (NBI) which summarizes some older data including a 1980 report which examined 360 industries and found that 36 of the 360 discharged directly into the river. I cannot find a copy of the 1980 report. From context (in the 2005 report) it appears that all 360 industries are distinct, but I cannot be certain. Noleander (talk) 00:18, 26 March 2026 (UTC)

Well, I think the reader gets the point, so that's fine. ~~ AirshipJungleman29 (talk) 10:01, 26 March 2026 (UTC)

• "The sacred ibis was important in the ancient Egyptian religion, and millions of the ibis were ritually sacrificed, leading to the eventual extinction of the species in Egypt" our article African sacred ibis state they were present well into the second millennium AD; not sure ancient Egyptian sacrifices can be said to have led to the extirpation...

Done. Thanks for catching that mistake. It now reads "... The species became locally extinct in Egypt in the late 19th century, but remains common in central and southern Africa." Noleander (talk) 00:31, 26 March 2026 (UTC)

Geological history

• "One hypothesis describes the Nile's geological history as a sequence of five evolutionary periods." ... is there a consequence to this sentence I'm not seeing?

Done. Changed the wording to "One hypothesis describes the Nile's geological history as a sequence of the following five evolutionary periods." ... the following five paragraphs then describe the five periods (one per paragraph). Also, the attached footnote contrasts it with an alternative hypothesis that uses eight periods. Noleander (talk) 00:36, 26 March 2026 (UTC)

• When did Obweruka disappear?

Done. I added a footnote stating "Obweruka existed from about 7.5 MYA to 2.5 MYA." The source also says that around 2.5 MYA that paleolake started draining to the west, implying it existed for a brief while after 2.5 MYA, but they don't go into details. Noleander (talk) 00:51, 26 March 2026 (UTC)

Human history

• Don't think sentences should begin with "and".

Done. Noleander (talk) 00:55, 26 March 2026 (UTC)

• I don't think the order/naming of the cataracts is ever explained in prose, which makes it somewhat confusing when numbers start getting dropped in.

Done. Enhanced the Nile#Main Nile section to explicitly name all six (1,2,3,4,6). In conjunction with the existing map in the Nile#Sources section that shows all cataracts, readers should be satisfied. Noleander (talk) 01:01, 26 March 2026 (UTC)

• Are there any details about how the Kerma culture/Funj Sultanate/Ethiopian Empire had relationships with the Nile, instead of just listing where and when they existed?

No, I could not find many specifics about how they interacted with the river (except the Dinka/Nuer pastoral migrations). If one were to follow WP:PROPORTION to the letter, the article would probably not mention those cultures at all because 98% of the cultural material in the sources focuses on Egypt & Islamic Sudan. I'm using editorial discretion and making a special effort to include Nubian/black cultures - in other words, to avoid being too Egypt-centric. Noleander (talk) 01:16, 26 March 2026 (UTC)

• Does footnote bh ("In 1857, John Hanning Speke and Richard Francis Burton started a search...") really add to the existing text?

Done. Removed that footnote (along with 20 or 30 other minor footnotes). Noleander (talk) 01:08, 26 March 2026 (UTC)

• Should the "Search for the source of the Nile" subsection be better placed as a subsection of "Sources", where it could be better integrated with the existing text?

I went back and forth on that choice. In the end, I feel it is better within "Human History" because that section is a list of human interactions with the river. Whereas the "Sources" section is primarily a statement of present-day geographical data. Noleander (talk) 03:25, 26 March 2026 (UTC)

Water politics in the modern era

• Footnote bl needs a citation.

Done. Removed the footnote (I think the statement is true, but I cannot find a source that directly supports it). Noleander (talk) 01:22, 26 March 2026 (UTC)

• "Egypt reserved the right ... Egypt assumed the right ... Egypt assumed the right" is a trifle repetitive.

Done. Changed to "Egypt reserved the right to monitor the Nile flow in the upstream countries, to undertake river-related projects without the consent of upriver nations, and to veto any construction projects that would adversely affect Egypt." Noleander (talk) 01:28, 26 March 2026 (UTC)

• "Egypt and Sudan in the north wielded more power than the other ten nations to the south" comes up around three times

Done. Eliminated repetition. Noleander (talk) 01:34, 26 March 2026 (UTC)

• If a "Declaration of Principles" was signed in 2015, what was the point of the subsequent talks in the US, the African Union, and the UAE, and the request for UNSC intervention?

The sources do not clearly explain (see Ranjan 2024, pp. 28-29). Reading between the lines, the 2015 Declaration of Principles was apparently very vague, and skimpy on details, numbers, and deadlines. Also: Egypt & Ethiopia didn't trust each other to carry-out whatever they signed. But that is speculation on my part. Noleander (talk) 01:38, 26 March 2026 (UTC)

Economy

• "The southern nations have few irrigation canals, instead relying on extensive rainfall: the amount of soil water used annually for crops in the south is 229 km3, which is more than twice the total annual water flow of the Nile River (about 100 km3)." this sentence largely duplicates what's just been said

Done. Noleander (talk) 02:52, 26 March 2026 (UTC)

• "accounts for the majority of inland (fresh water) fish caught in the African continent ... is more than half of the total fresh water yield from the entire African continent" more duplication

Done. Noleander (talk) 02:52, 26 March 2026 (UTC)

• Nile boat is linked as a hatnote under Ancient Egyptian civilization but doesn't get a mention here?

Done. I removed the hatnote link to Nile boat because the term "nile boat" is not a commonly used term by academics, and the term is not well defined. The Nile boat article is a bit misleading in its current form; and linking to it could confuse readers. The article Ancient Egyptian royal ships is better quality, but has a very narrow focus. Noleander (talk) 03:02, 26 March 2026 (UTC)

• Be wary of MOS:SOB in note bw.

Done, I think. The footnote IDs have changed over the past couple of days, but I assume that is the footnote that listed a dozen parks near the Nile? If so: that footnote has been deleted. Noleander (talk) 03:07, 26 March 2026 (UTC)

• This article implies that the purpose of the proposed Jonglei Canal was to improve navigation, but the relevant article indicates its purpose was increasing agriculture on the lower Nile.

Done. Changed wording to "Plans to build a canal through the swamp – called the Jonglei Canal – were initiated in the early 20th century with the goal of providing more water to grow cotton in Egypt. Construction was ...". Noleander (talk) 02:08, 26 March 2026 (UTC)

• It feels like the third paragraph of "Transportation" would work better as the first.

Done. Noleander (talk) 03:09, 26 March 2026 (UTC)

• "along with the nearby temples that were moved during construction to avoid becoming submerged" this feels like it should have been discussed already

The temple relocation was discussed above in the section Nile#Post-colonial era - "An international campaign to save some monuments from becoming submerged by the new reservoir ...". Noleander (talk) 03:12, 26 March 2026 (UTC)

My mistake. ~~ AirshipJungleman29 (talk) 10:01, 26 March 2026 (UTC)

In culture

• Seems very non-modern focused. No mention of the renowned Death on the Nile and adaptations, recent political pop songs from both Egypt and Ethiopia, productions such as The Wizard of the Nile, etc.?

Done. Thanks for providing those outstanding links and sources. I've added four works of art to the "In Culture" section from the years 1871, 1937, 1966, and 2023:

• " Giuseppe Verdi was commissioned by Isma'il Pasha to compose an opera to celebrate the opening of the Suez Canal. The opera, Aida, was performed at the newly-constructed Egyptian Royal Opera House in 1871. The opera's third act is set on the banks of the Nile river."
• " Agatha Christie wrote the popular 1937 mystery novel Death on the Nile, about a murder on a Nile steamboat, which inspired several adaptations."
• " Adrift on the Nile is a 1966 novel by Egyptian author and Nobel prize winner Naguib Mahfouz about a young man that lives on a houseboat on the Nile. The river is a metaphor for a life that he cannot control, leading him to turn his back on society."
• "Since the start of construction of the Grand Ethiopian Renaissance Dam, Ethiopian musicians have produced songs that celebrate and glorify the Nile and the dam."

To stay in compliance with the WP:OR or WP:SYNTH policies I'm tentatively limiting the article to art/film/music that sources analyze in the context of the Nile (rather than performing my own search for artworks that happen to mention the Nile). Noleander (talk) 03:24, 27 March 2026 (UTC)

One more option Noleander; you may have access to a recent publication entitled Ancient Egypt in Video Games through WP:TWL (my link here); the fifth chapter (titled Pharaohs, Labourers and Wonder Builders: Illustrating Ancient Egypt with Game Mechanics in Strategy Games) contains a significant amount of discussion on the Nile's depiction in the game Civilization VI (pp. 95, 100) and wider culture (p. 101). ~~ AirshipJungleman29 (talk) 13:57, 28 March 2026 (UTC)

@AirshipJungleman29: Done. Used that source and added "The Nile plays a prominent role in several video games, including Civilization VI.^[1]" - The source has a section "A Problematic Representation" which asserts that many European/American representations of ancient Egypt incorrectly portray the civilization as being 100% focused on the river (and ignore aspects of the civilization that were located in (or used) the desert). That is interesting, but I have not seen it echoed in other sources. In fact, many sources say the opposite: that ancient Egypt was strongly focused on the river in nearly every way. So I did not put that assertion into the Nile article. Noleander (talk) 15:40, 28 March 2026 (UTC)

I might add to the above later. ~~ AirshipJungleman29 (talk) 12:45, 25 March 2026 (UTC)

@AirshipJungleman29: - I have replied to all the issues you mentioned above. I implemented the vast majority, and added explanations for the handful that were not implemented. You inputs have been exceedingly valuable, and very welcome! Noleander (talk) 02:00, 27 March 2026 (UTC)

Support a wonderful article, ready to join the list of vital-3 FAs. ~~ AirshipJungleman29 (talk) 15:44, 28 March 2026 (UTC)

Mr rnddude

I'm not sure I have the time or energy to review the prose of the whole article, but I want to take a look at the statements related to ancient Egypt.

• In the ancient Egyptian language, the same word was used for 'Nile' and 'river': jtrw. and The Nile was also called Ar or Aur meaning 'black' – in reference to the dark color of the Nile floodwaters as they carry sediment from upriver. – These two statements employ different transliteration techniques. The former is preferrable over the latter and the following comment will illustrate why.
• The second statement is additionally dubious and was difficult to track down. The Egyptian word for 'black' is km; I can find no reference in any of my dictionaries or grammar books (Allen, Budge (outdated, by comprehensive), Faulkner, or Gardiner) to a word that could be rendered as 'ar' or 'aur' that means 'black'. The transliteration choice here renders it quite difficult to work out what word is even being referred to: Is it ꜣr, ꜥr, ꜣwr, ꜥwr, wr, ỉr/jr, or even ꜥꜣ? The only ones I can make sense of are the last three. There is km-wr or 'Great Black' (km = black; wr = great). The only problem is that this name refers to the bitter lakes region of Egypt. The other option is jtrw-ꜥꜣ (Jeteru-aa or Iteru-aa) or jr-ꜥꜣ (Jer-aa or Ir-aa) meaning 'Great River'. Budge gives jwr-ꜥꜣ as 'ȧur-āa' as a name for the Nile's most significant branch or jwr as 'ȧur' meaning 'stream, canal, river, arm of the Nile'. That explains 'Aur' though with an outdated transliteration; but it does not explain 'black'.
  It also doesn't help that the source states that ⲫⲓⲁⲣⲟ is the Coptic word for 'black'. For one: Which dialect? For two: No? The word for 'black' is ⲕⲁⲙ (Sahidic) or ⲭⲙⲟⲙ (Bohairic) which descend from km. The word for river is ⲉⲓⲉⲣⲟ (Sahidic) or ⲓⲁⲣⲟ (Bohairic). The Britannica article doesn't cite its sources here, so beyond this I'm in the dark. (Sources for Coptic: Sahidic dictionaryOnline Coptic dictionaryBohairic dictionary) Mr rnddude (talk) 00:25, 27 March 2026 (UTC)

@Mr rnddude - Always good to get input from a subject-matter expert. I've removed the Coptic sentence from the article; and also the "Aur" Egyptian word sentence. The remaining two sentences are:

1) "In the ancient Egyptian language, the same word was used for 'Nile' and 'river': jtrw."{{sfn|Allen|2000|pp=21,101}}

Allen p 21: "... the Nile (known in Egyptian only as jtrw 'the river') ..."

Allen p 101: "... jtrw 'river' ..."

2) "Egyptians called their own country kmt meaning 'black', in reference to the dark color of the Nile floodwaters as they carried sediment from upriver."{{sfn|Allen|2000|p=470}}

Allen : p 470: "kmt (noun) 'Egypt' (literally 'The Black' referring to the cultivated soil along the Nile."

Allen: p 339 (footnote) "The word kmt 'Egypt' literally means 'black', referring to the soil of the Nile Valley."

Sentence (2) was in the article until a month ago, but was commented out for size reasons ... but it still appears in the raw Wiki Markup, so I want to make sure it is accurate (I've restored it to the body text for now, so it is more visible). If there is a source that suggests that sentences 1 or 2 are wrong or misleading, I can use that source instead of (or in addition to) Allen. If the source is not online, can you could provide me with the relevant snippet? Thanks! - Noleander (talk) 03:12, 27 March 2026 (UTC)

The first sentence is fine. The second sentence needs an adjustment, but nothing to do with the source. James Peter Allen is HQRS. As Allen states, kmt refers to the colour of the land or soil of the Nile Valley. You have kmt as referring to 'the dark color of the Nile floodwaters' from the sediment it carries as it flows – I assume that is because of the Britannica source – I would switch the phrasing to 'in reference to the color of the fertile soil of the Nile valley' or similar. You may also specify a translation of kmt as 'the Black Land'. You have a different copy of Allen with differing pagination, but check the 'Dictionary' section under 'k' (alphabetically ... š, q, k, g, t ...), you might also be able to ctrl+f for literally "Black land" (p. 533 in mine, probably p. 505ish in yours; your p. 101 is my p. 128). Mr rnddude (talk) 05:19, 27 March 2026 (UTC)

• Egyptian hieroglyphs can be quite complicated. You give the hieroglyphs for river or Nile as: This form appears to refer to the Schoenus or 'river-length'. There are often multiple ways to render Egyptian words. For just 'river', Allen (p. 515 for me) gives two variants, the first being: Faulkner uses a more minimalist version, see p. 33 (if you have an archive.org account to borrow) or p. 40 (no borrow needed), with: Gardiner, See p. 43 & p. 623, goes with: There are many more variants as well. Both Faulkner and Gardiner also use the version that is currently in article for 'river-measure'. For Faulkner see same page and for Gardiner see p. 199. This convention may be purely for convenience or there may be a meaningful difference. I don't know, I don't measure rivers. Mr rnddude (talk) 07:29, 27 March 2026 (UTC)

  Done. I updated the article to use the plainer hieroglyph from Gardiner (p 43, 623), and added a footnote telling readers about alternative hieroglyphs, with cites to Faulkner and Allen. Noleander (talk) 13:32, 27 March 2026 (UTC)

A. Parrot

Some comments exclusively on the ancient Egypt-related portions.

• "A tune, Hymn to the Nile…" While Egyptian hymns are often presumed to have been sung, there is no record of what melody may have been used for any dynastic Egyptian poem, so "tune" seems like the wrong word. The webpage used as a reference is also less than ideal, as it's based on a text from 1907 and probably overstates the age of the hymn. This page is more up-to-date, and one of its subpages does include a translation. You seem to be listing just a sampling of cultural references to the Nile in these sections, so I won't press this point, but it may be worth mentioning that this hymn is only the best-known of a handful that were dedicated to the Nile. (I can source this point myself if you want to include it.)

Done. Removed word "tune" and changed to use the new source. Noleander (talk) 13:51, 27 March 2026 (UTC)

• "…the east side was for the living, and the west side – including the Theban Necropolis and the Giza pyramid complex – was for the dead." This is a gross oversimplification. Many ancient Egyptian cities, including the largest of them all, Memphis, were on the west bank. It's true that most tombs were west of the Nile, but even that wasn't universal, and it's related to beliefs about the sun rather than the idea of the Nile as a dividing line, so my recommendation would be to cut this whole sentence.

Done. Removed sentence. Noleander (talk) 13:35, 27 March 2026 (UTC)

• "The Egyptian religion placed the source of the Nile's annual flood at Elephantine Island (at the first cataract) where the floodwaters were believed to flow up out of the netherworld." This is true but kind of incomplete. On the pages cited, Assmann says there were two purported sources for the Nile: the First Cataract for Upper Egypt and a source in the vicinity of what is now Old Cairo for Lower Egypt. That said, most other secondary sources only mention the belief that the Nile sprang from the First Cataract region, and I sometimes wonder what Egyptian text Assmann drew this from.

I've looked at a few sources to see how they discuss the ancient Egyptians' view of the source(s) of the Nile, and - as you say - they emphasize the Elephantine Island location. None of the sources I looked at mention the Old Cairo second location except Assman. For that reason, it is probably best to leave the article as it stands now (mentioning only Elephantine). Noleander (talk) 14:24, 27 March 2026 (UTC)

• Following on the two points above, instead of the east bank and west bank, you could say something about the division between Upper Egypt, corresponding to the main Nile downstream of the First Cataract, and Lower Egypt, corresponding to the Delta. The political unification of Upper and Lower Egypt is usually considered the beginning of dynastic Egyptian history, so it might even be mentioned in the section on ancient Egyptian history. This division, the "Two Lands", was central to the Egyptian worldview. E.g., the illustration of Hapy in the myth and religion section is the sema-tawy motif, representing him binding together the Two Lands. (I can source these points myself if you want to include them.)

@A. Parrot: - I will take you up on your offer :-) Would you please steer me towards a source or two that discusses the Upper/Lower division and how that division related to the Nile River. Thanks! Noleander (talk) 14:27, 27 March 2026 (UTC)

Allen 2000, p. 22, points out the division between Upper and Lower Egypt. Other sources are numerous (e.g., the ideological duality of Upper & Lower Egypt and their unification appears in the first paragraph of the "Lower Egypt" entry in the Oxford Encyclopedia of Ancient Egypt, vol. 2 p. 305, and the start of Chapter 2 of A History of Ancient Egypt by Marc Van De Mieroop, pp. 27-29). Possibly the most significant point is a passage in The Complete Cities of Ancient Egypt by Steven Snape (pp. 181-182) about how the shifting waterways in the Delta made the patterns of settlement there much more complex than in Upper Egypt. If you can't access these sources, I can type up these passages and email them to you over the weekend. A. Parrot (talk) 16:29, 27 March 2026 (UTC)

Thanks for identifying those sources. I can access them all, so no worries about providing me with quotes. I should be able to take it from here. Noleander (talk) 17:10, 27 March 2026 (UTC)

@A. Parrot: - I've added two new passages into the article:

"Ancient Egypt consisted of two regions: Lower Egypt (the Nile Delta) and Upper Egypt (the Nile Valley, roughly between Giza and the first cataract). The Nile played a role in determining the unique character of each region, because the ever-shifting waterways in Lower Egypt meant that transportation routes, settlements, and administrative regions were often forced to relocate. The Lower and Upper regions were each represented by a unique Nile plant: papyrus and sedge, respectively." Redford 2001, pp. 17, 305–306, Articles: "Geography", "Lower Egypt" harvnb error: no target: CITEREFRedford2001 (help). Redford 2001a, pp. 464–466, Article: "Upper Egypt" harvnb error: no target: CITEREFRedford2001a (help)

and

" The sun god Ra passed through the sky each day from east to west, and the three phases of the day (sunrise, daytime, and sunset) corresponded to the human lifecycle: birth, life, and death. For this reason, many burial sites were positioned on the west bank of the Nile, where they would be closer to the setting sun." Redford 2001, p. 147, Article: "Hymns" harvnb error: no target: CITEREFRedford2001 (help). Redford 2001a, pp. 123, 376, Articles: "Re", "Temples" harvnb error: no target: CITEREFRedford2001a (help). Tvedt 2021, p. 10 harvnb error: no target: CITEREFTvedt2021 (help). Fleming & Lothian 1997, pp. 18, 29, 60 harvnb error: no target: CITEREFFlemingLothian1997 (help).

My intention is not to present a complete explanation of these complex topics to the reader; rather, it is to illustrate that the Nile river permeated nearly every aspect of the life of Ancient Egypt. These seem like two excellent examples. Regarding the "burial on west bank of Nile" material: Although the river was not the reason that many burials were on the west bank, many readers will be curious why so many major burial sites were on that side. It seems appropriate for the Nile article to answer that common question, even if the explanation is not based on the river itself. If you have a moment to review this new text, and let me know if they are wanting, it would be appreciated. Noleander (talk) 22:49, 27 March 2026 (UTC)

@A. Parrot: - Thanks: those are some excellent suggestions and ideas. I see from your home page that you have written several articles about ancient Egypt that achieved Featured Article status ... nice work! I'm wrapping up for the day, but I'll start implementing your suggestions tomorrow. Noleander (talk) 03:20, 27 March 2026 (UTC)

• I haven't reviewed extensively enough to call this a support, but all my concerns have been addressed. A. Parrot (talk) 22:09, 28 March 2026 (UTC)

Llewee

• "Egyptians called their own country" - not sure the word "own" is adding much

Done. Noleander (talk) 19:31, 29 March 2026 (UTC)

• "The distance was measured along the centerline of the river using satellite imagery." -Obviously writing from a position of ignorance, but it is not hugely clear to me why this is significant.

Hmmm. I'm not sure how to improve that. When geographers measure the length of a river, there are various approaches: then can measure down the centerline; or along the left bank or the right bank; or "hug the inside corner" for a shorter distance. Each approach will produce a different value for the river's length. The purpose of that sentence "... distance was measured along the centerline..." is to tell the reader what approach these geographers were using. Then, when comparing with the lengths of other rivers, measured by other geographers, one can tell if they are using the same approach or a different approach (are they comparing apples to oranges?). I'm happy to improve the text to make it clearer - if anyone has suggestions let me know & I can implement it. Noleander (talk) 19:31, 29 March 2026 (UTC)

• "Although the Nile is the longest river in the world, it is far from having the largest discharge." - This feels like odd wording to me.--Llewee (talk) 22:42, 31 March 2026 (UTC)

Done. Changed to "Although the Nile is the longest river in the world, it does not have the the largest discharge." Noleander (talk) 00:00, 1 April 2026 (UTC)

• "backs up during this time at the confluence" - Is this where it meets the river?

Done. Added a wikilink to confluence at that location; and also at the 1st occurrence of "confluence". Noleander (talk) 00:00, 1 April 2026 (UTC)

• "The cumulative amount of rock eroded in the past 30 million years from the Ethiopia headwaters of the Nile is about 102,000 km3, which is roughly comparable to the volume of the soil in the Nile Delta (including the underwater portion) which is about 150,000 km3" - Is this soil all eroded from the rock?

Done. Clarified wording to be: "The soil in the Nile Delta originated as rocks in Ethiopia. The cumulative amount of rock eroded in the past 30 million years from the Ethiopia headwaters .... Noleander (talk) 00:10, 1 April 2026 (UTC)

• "These data were" - I think "This data was" or "These figures were" would sound more natural here.

Done. Changed to "This data was ...". Noleander (talk) 00:10, 1 April 2026 (UTC)

• "Every measurement site had unique collection time spans, specified in the sources provided for each datum." - You only have a citation after one of the bullet points so it is hard to know what sources you are referring to.

Done. Changed to: "The sediment transport data was gathered over a wide range of years, spanning from 1997 to 2019. Every measurement site had unique collection time spans, specified in Lemma 2019, p. 11 and Sutcliffe 2009, p. 359. Noleander (talk) 00:17, 1 April 2026 (UTC)

• "as well as policy makers who negotiate water sharing issues" - It might be helpful to include an example of the kind of thing you mean here. Perhaps in a footnote.--Llewee (talk) 23:12, 31 March 2026 (UTC)

Done. Added new footnote: "Sources and sinks are useful to policy makers when negotiating international water-sharing issues, such as dam construction. In the 21st century, Egypt and Sudan continue to rely on extracting large amounts of water from the Nile for their existence. Some experts predict that the Nile Basin may experience a water scarcity problem in the future, if population growth, agricultural needs, and climate change combine to create a scenario where the water demands exceed the amount of water available. (citations are in the article, omitted here for clarity). Noleander (talk) 00:28, 1 April 2026 (UTC)

• "The data is based on measurements made at a dozen river measurement stations." - Do these stations use the same measurement methods as discussed in the previous section?

More or less. To measure discharge (flow) they measure how deep & wide the river is, and multiply it by the speed of the river current. To measure sediment transport: they see how much dirt/sand is in a liter of river water & multiply it by the discharge. Let me know if you think that should be explained in the article. Due to article size issues, I'm reluctant to add material without a reviewer saying it is necessary. Noleander (talk) 00:32, 1 April 2026 (UTC)

• "Measurements of the Nile's flow have always been essential to help Egyptians manage their safety and irrigation. ... An ideal flood in Egypt – not too high and not too low – was a 6-meter (20 ft) rise over the non-flood water level." - I assume the human aspects of the river's history come up later. Nevertheless, it might be helpful to briefly explain why it was beneficial for Egyptians to know these things and why a certain level of flooding was desirable.

Done: Changed to "An ideal flood in Egypt – not too high and not too low – was a 6-meter (20 ft) rise over the non-flood water level. Any higher and disastrous floods may damage the river communities; any lower, and fertile silt would not be deposited on the croplands." Noleander (talk) 02:50, 1 April 2026 (UTC)

• "the ranges of some species have been reduced due to human encroachment on habitat" - Shouldn't this be "on their habitat"?--Llewee (talk) 22:48, 8 April 2026 (UTC)

Done. Noleander (talk) 23:12, 8 April 2026 (UTC)

• "Historically, the water of the Nile was noted for being drinkable," - Perhaps it would be helpful to include a specific example of this opinion from a prominent source in a footnote.

Done. Noleander (talk) 23:12, 8 April 2026 (UTC)

• "The Nile perch was introduced to Lake Victoria by Ugandan authorities in a clandestine effort to create a new fishery; but this has never been acknowledged by Uganda." - Were they reluctant to admit to this because of the environmental damage?

The sources I read do not say. It may have been because there are three countries that share Lake Victoria, and perhaps Uganda did not want to ask permission of the other two nations. But I'm not sure. Noleander (talk) 23:39, 8 April 2026 (UTC)

• "These five periods were proposed by Abdelsalam 2018 ... Other scientists hypothesize a different set of evolutionary periods" - Is there a reason why you decided to focus on this particular version of events?

Yes, the other geological history source is Rushdi Said, but Said's theory was older (he first proposed it around 1993) and – more importantly – it is far more complicated. The 2018 Abdelsalam source has 30 years of additional research behind it, and it is much more understandable to lay readers of Wikipedia. Even the names of Said's eight phases are more arcane. I don't think either one is "right" or "wrong" ... they are simply two different approaches to interpreting the same ancient, vague geological data. Readers that are curious can follow the links to Said's writings and go from there. Noleander (talk) 23:45, 8 April 2026 (UTC)

• "The first evolutionary period was from about 20 million years ago (MYA) to 6 MYA. Around 20 MYA, the west flank of the East African Rift System began to uplift ..." Are these events known for certain to have happened or are they based on the hypothesis mentioned above.

The specific geological events are fairly certain, according to my interpretation of multiple sources. The hypothesis/guesswork revolves mostly around how to partition the long sequence of geological events into periods The mere act of dividing 20 million years into 4 or 5 or 8 eras is the creative/subjective work. An entire WP article could be written about the geological history of the Nile and various interpretations of it. Noleander (talk) 23:50, 8 April 2026 (UTC)

• "The present-day course of the Nile was established in this period." - Given that this period goes up to the present day, it's not clear when the current course was established.

I changed that text to "The present-day course of the Nile was established early in this period." [emphasis added] The sources state values between 15,000 to 12,000 KYA. I provided three sources for that sentence and gave the specific value from each source. I think scholars will never be able to agree on a specific number, because the river is always changing, so there is no way to concretely define what "flows in the current course" means. Noleander (talk) 00:06, 9 April 2026 (UTC)

• "Some scholars have hypothesized that these peoples, or their contemporaries, may have domesticated sheep, goats, or cattle." - I assume this means their contemporaries who lived in the area in which case that should be clarified.

Done. Changed to ... or other peoples that resided nearby,.... Noleander (talk) 23:39, 18 April 2026 (UTC)

• ""up" was south; "left" was east, and "right" was west" - Could this be clarified? Were "up" and "south" the same words in the ancient Egyptian language?

Done. Changed to ... the same word could be used for both up and south; another word for left and east; and another for right and west....

• "The Egyptians were familiar with the course of the Nile upstream to the sixth cataract (present-day Khartoum), but apparently were not familiar with the river's course (nor its source) beyond that." The use of the word "apparantly" suggests it isn't clear in a way that is a bit comfusing.--Llewee (talk) 23:16, 18 April 2026 (UTC)

Done. Removed word "apparently". The sources use terms like that, to convey they are 99% certain, but not 100% certain, I think. Noleander (talk) 23:42, 18 April 2026 (UTC)

• "who led Kush from the cities Napata and Meroë" - What is the term "Kush" referring to here, the Kushite people?

Done. Changed to "The Kushite Empire conquered much of Egypt under the rule of its Black Pharaohs, who led the empire from the cities Napata and Meroë on the banks of the Nile". Noleander (talk) 14:03, 21 April 2026 (UTC)

• "His accounts were not published until the 20th century, and do not contain a specific date for his visit to Gish Abay." - So when did Europeans in general find out about the source of the Blue Nile?

Done. Changed to "His accounts do not contain a specific date for his visit to Gish Abay. Later European explorers who reached Ethiopia in the 17th and 18th centuries – including Jerónimo Lobo and James Bruce – publicized Páez's writings and estimated that he visited the source between 1613 and 1618." Removed the "not published until the 20th century" since that was causing confusion. That simply means that his works were not printed & sold until 20th century; but before then, there were manuscript copies that were passed around and studied in Europe. Noleander (talk) 14:09, 21 April 2026 (UTC)

• "After the British colonial rule of Egypt commenced in 1882," - Would it be better grammar to take out "the"?

Done. Noleander (talk) 14:11, 21 April 2026 (UTC)

• " The agreement provided that Egypt and Sudan utilize 48 and 4 billion cubic meters of the Nile flow per year, respectively. Egypt reserved the right to monitor the Nile flow in the upstream countries, to undertake river-related projects without the consent of upriver nations, and to veto any construction projects that would adversely affect Egypt" - This agreement seems quite sympathetic to Egypt, was there a reason for this?

I cannot find a specific reason for the apportionment in the sources. I suspect the apportionment was based on (1) Egypt had a much larger population than Sudan; (2) Egypt had more acreage that required irrigation than Sudan; (3) Egypt was already withdrawing more water than Sudan (in roughly that 12:1 ratio); and (4) Sudan was politically very weak, and at that time was ruled by Britain & Egypt, so Egypt was in a dominant negotiating position. But that is just speculation on my part. When the agreement was updated in 1959 (and Sudan was more independent) the ratio improved in Sudan's favor from 12:1 to 3:1. Noleander (talk) 14:19, 21 April 2026 (UTC)

• "Upstream countries within the Nile Basin were excluded from the 1959 agreement – including Ethiopia, which is the source of over two-thirds of the Nile's water." Why?

The source does not say why the upstream countries were excluded. Reading between the lines: in 1959 the most important upstream country, Ethiopia, was relatively poor and did not have much political power. Ethiopia did not build their first major dam until 1973; and it was not until 2011 that Ethiopia had sufficient funds to announce the creation of the first dam large enough to impact Egypt & Sudan - the GERD. Noleander (talk) 17:21, 21 April 2026 (UTC)

• "In 1960, Egypt started building the Aswan High Dam which stores roughly two years' flow of the Nile River." - Why is it linked here rather than the previous paragraph?

Done. Thanks for finding that. Noleander (talk) 14:22, 21 April 2026 (UTC)

• "At the start of the 21st century, power shifted to the upstream nations as they began to build dams without the consent of Egypt or Sudan." - Was there a reason why the upstream nations now felt able to do so this when they hadn't done previously?

I cannot find an explanation in the sources, but I think the explanation proposed two questions above is valid: Ethiopia was relatively poor until the late 20th century, and it was not until 2011 that Ethiopia got the money together to build a dam big enough to catch the attention of Egypt and Sudan. Egypt was several decades ahead of Ethiopia in terms of economic development. Noleander (talk) 17:28, 21 April 2026 (UTC)

• "Tourism and recreation" - Do any statistics exist for how many tourists visit the Nile today?--Llewee (talk) 13:00, 21 April 2026 (UTC)

  I just did a quick search for figures, and all I can find are number of tourists visiting Egypt (14-19 million annually); number of tourists visiting pyramids (14-15 million); number of tourists visiting Luxor (5 million). None of the sources state how many are visiting the river, as a river. I searched for "number of tourists taking cruises on the Nile" but could not find specific numbers. If one assumed that 10% of the visitors to Egypt got on a boat, that would be about 1.5 to 2 million. All of the above numbers are for Egypt only: it is unlikely that any RS provides aggregate statistics for all the countries in the Nile Basin. In summary: I don't think sources provide a solid, reliable figure for number of people "visiting the Nile". Noleander (talk) 17:36, 21 April 2026 (UTC)

  @Llewee - I think I've addressed all the questions you posed above. Noleander (talk) 17:37, 21 April 2026 (UTC)

  Yes, I'm happy for my last edit on here for a while to be in Support of the nomination. Llewee (talk) 19:00, 21 April 2026 (UTC)

Source review

Hope I don't have to spotcheck this. Despite the number of footnotes and refs, it seems like we are mostly working off a few sources. Fair enough, in a topic this broad you need to focus on the most important aspects. I am not sure that MDPI is a very reliable source. For an African river, there sure are only a few African sources. Jo-Jo Eumerus (talk) 12:58, 8 April 2026 (UTC)

@Jo-Jo Eumerus - Thanks for taking time to review the sources.

1. "For an African river, there sure are only a few African sources" - Correct, the vast majority of authors that write on the Nile are from Europe and US. The academic authors in the fields of Geography, History, and Hydrology typically write in English (regardless of what continent they are from), so language is not the issue. My gut feeling is that the large number of non-African authors is due to (a) The history of British colonialism in northeast Africa (Britain had large numbers of scientists, geographers and explorers studying the region for over a century); and (b) the fascination many Europeans had for Egypt & the Nile. So, today, the world's foremost Nile experts are all from Europe & US: Tvedt, Sutcliffe, Collins, Dumont, and Hurst. In spite of that, I made an effort to utilize many authors from Africa, including Abdelsalam, Abotalib, Alnaqbi, Hassan, Hegab, Shuka, El-Shabrawy, El-Sheekhm, Embabi, etc.
2. "I am not sure that MDPI is a very reliable source." - You are right to be concerned. Wikipedia:Reliable sources/Perennial sources lists MDPI with a yellow caution. WP:MDPI says: "Publications in MDPI journals are considered questionable. Editors have raised concerns about the robustness of MDPI's peer review process and their lack of selectivity in what they publish." That same page, however, notes that only 5% of MDPI's publications are suspect; and it does not have a red "prohibited" status. I used three MDPI sources only reluctantly. Why did I use them? Because of issue #1 above .. a lack of African sources. All three of the MDPI sources used are by African authors. I have access to the full content of these three sources, and - in my assessment - the content is accurate and reliable. In addition, they are not used in the article to support any contentious or controversial material. That said, if you feel the MDPI sources are not acceptable, I can remove the sources and the (small amount of) material that they are supporting.

Noleander (talk) 14:19, 8 April 2026 (UTC)

I know from experience that even African topics are better covered abroad; try to find the African sources for African humid period some time. That said, comprehensiveness means that I need to ask in thus cases. Jo-Jo Eumerus (talk) 08:01, 10 April 2026 (UTC)

Aha .. you wrote African humid period, very nice! This article links to it, as you know. If you ever want to take it to FAC, let me know and I'll be happy to do a Peer Review of it. Noleander (talk) 17:30, 10 April 2026 (UTC)

Given its length, I don't think it'd pass FAC. In some years it will hit the PEIS limit and then a split would be needed; that would make it FAC viable but upkeep becomes harder after a split so I am not going to do it pre-emptively. The other articles I am working on for FAC right now are Lake Tauca, Laguna Miscanti and at FAC right now is Misti. Jo-Jo Eumerus (talk) 09:58, 12 April 2026 (UTC)

Btw, since the 1980s, universities have been critically underfunded. What little funds there are get put into hard sciences and technological disciplines that further economic development. Re history, a lot of the main African scholars moved to the US, and there's been very little research done on precolonial history since the '80s because it's not viewed as relevant for today's problems Kowal2701 (talk, contribs) 15:13, 11 April 2026 (UTC)

With some of these MDPI uses for dams, I wonder if government sources or sources linked to the dam operators would be better. Jo-Jo Eumerus (talk) 09:59, 12 April 2026 (UTC)

I eliminated all three sources published by MDPI (although I have no reason to think the sources contained errors or were biased in any way). One I removed altogether (not needed); the other two I replaced with NGO sources on the dams. 01:55, 13 April 2026 (UTC) Noleander (talk) 01:55, 13 April 2026 (UTC)

Afternoon Jo-Jo. Is this one ready? Cheers. Gog the Mild (talk) 18:10, 26 April 2026 (UTC)

Yes. Jo-Jo Eumerus (talk) 12:44, 29 April 2026 (UTC)

RoySmith

• The list of tributaries in Names and etymology appear to be in alphabetical order. I don't know that it's wrong to do that, but I can't help wondering if there might be some more logical ordering bases on geography or some other characteristic. As a minor matter, this might cause some awkwardness when the article is translated.

I couldn't think of any other sensible sequence. This Etymology section is about "words as words" - so alphabetization makes sense. If the list was in another section on, say, geography, then listing them in the order of upstream-to-downstream might make some sense. But I can change it to any order you want. Noleander (talk) 01:33, 4 May 2026 (UTC)

Nah. Your point about this being the etymology section makes sense. RoySmith (talk) 12:21, 4 May 2026 (UTC)

• The highest sources of the Nile (based on elevation) Do you really need to say "based on elevation"? What other meaning would "highest" have?

Done. I removed "based on elevation". I originally put it in so readers didn't think "highest" meant "most upstream", which is an entirely different animal. For example, "Lower Egypt" is lower elevation and "Upper Egypt" is higher elevation. Noleander (talk) 01:33, 4 May 2026 (UTC)

• The legendary Mountains of the Moon, described by Ptolemy, perhaps not all of our readers will know who Ptolemy was, so "Greek astronomer Ptolemy".

Done. Noleander (talk) 01:40, 4 May 2026 (UTC)

• Some have suggested that the genuine source of the Nile is the rain clouds that are often found above Lake Victoria, because they supply five times more water to the lake than the rivers that flow into the lake.[28] I'm confused how this works. If the lake does not feed the Nile, how does it matter how much rain falls into the lake?

Done. Changed to "Some have suggested that the genuine source of the Nile is the rain clouds that are often found above Lake Victoria, because they contribute the vast majority of the lake's water." Lake Victoria is a major source of water for the Nile. The sources are saying that the lake's water come mostly from rainfall (rather than, say, rivers feeding into the lake) therefore the rain clouds are - arguably - a major source of the Nile. Let me know if you think it still needs more work. Noleander (talk) 01:40, 4 May 2026 (UTC)

Maybe something like (stealing liberally from Lake Victoria):

Lake Victoria, spanning Tanzania, Uganda, and Kenya, feeds the White Nile from its outflow at Jinja, Uganda. The lake, in turn, is fed by the Sio, Nzoia, Yala, Nyando, Sondu Miriu, Mogusi, and Migori Rivers. Some have suggested, however, that the genuine source of the Nile is the rain clouds that are often found above Lake Victoria, because they contribute the vast majority of the lake's water.

RoySmith (talk) 21:54, 4 May 2026 (UTC)

Done. Changed it to "Lake Victoria – shared by Tanzania, Uganda, and Kenya – is sometimes informally described as the source, because it feeds the White Nile from its outflow at Jinja, Uganda. However, some have suggested that the genuine source of the Nile is the rain clouds that are often found above Lake Victoria, because they contribute the vast majority of the lake's water." Noleander (talk) 01:36, 5 May 2026 (UTC)

• The distance was measured along the centerline of the river using satellite imagery. I think I saw somebody else mention this, but doesn't the river shift course (certainly through the delta) every so often, so I think this deserves a mention of what year this measurement was made.

Done. Noleander (talk) 01:55, 4 May 2026 (UTC)

• You keep saying "Nile River" in the text. I think you can drop the "River"

Done. The sources frequently use "Nile River", much like "River Thames" is an alternative to plain "Thames". But, for simplicity, I removed most of the "River"s from the article. Noleander (talk) 01:55, 4 May 2026 (UTC)

• This region begins near the town of Nimule and extends to Lake No, and is entirely within South Sudan Drop the first "and", i.e. "near the town of Nimule, extends to ..."

Done. Noleander (talk) 02:06, 4 May 2026 (UTC)

• The drainage basin of the Bahr el Ghazal River is large – about 860,000 square km You are inconsistent whether you provide metric-english unit conversions.

The article is consistent with MOS:UNITS which permits metric-only for scientific articles, and this article is primarily about geography. All values shown are metric only, except I did include imperial units for length/distance values, as a courtesy to readers. But I can remove those imperial values if you think the inconsistency is bad. All the reliable sources use metric. The tabular data in the Hydrology section would become illegible if imperial numbers were included. Noleander (talk)

• it is a permanent stream east of Wau, but a seasonal stream to the west.[40] link to Intermittent river

Done. Noleander (talk) 02:05, 4 May 2026 (UTC)

• has several other tributaries that feed into it. Isn't "feed into it" redundant? That's what tributaries do.

Done.Noleander (talk) 02:20, 4 May 2026 (UTC)

• The drainage basins of the Blue Nile tributary and the Atbarah tributary You're already talking about tributaries, I don't think you need to repeat that here.

Done.Noleander (talk) 02:20, 4 May 2026 (UTC)

• In {{Nile River routemap}} wouldn't it make more sense to have the diagram from bottom to top, paralleling the flow of the river from south to north?

The convention in the hydrology world for those diagrams is that top is upstream, bottom is downstream. I think the reason is that water flows downhill. Also: reversing that diagram would be like crawling on my hands and knees over broken glass for ten miles :-) Noleander (talk) 02:26, 4 May 2026 (UTC)

I see your point, but this is FAC; isn't crawling on your hands and knees over broken glass for ten miles what you came here for? RoySmith (talk) 12:17, 4 May 2026 (UTC)

• File:Monthly variations of the flow of the Nile River.svg need alt text.

Done. Thanks for finding that. Noleander (talk) 02:14, 4 May 2026 (UTC)

• I'm not sure I'm a fan of having the four tables in Sources and sinks: tributaries hidden by default.

Done. Noleander (talk) 02:14, 4 May 2026 (UTC)

• Lake Victoria experienced increased eutrophication I think the word eutrophication is obscure enough that it deserved an in-line definition.

Done. Changed to "... increased eutrophication (excess nutrients in the lake which cause the growth of plants and algae that deplete the oxygen in the water). ". Noleander (talk) 02:20, 4 May 2026 (UTC)

• 15 thousand years ago (KYA) lower-case "kya" per Year#Abbreviations for "years ago"

Done. Also changed MYA -> mya. Thanks for pointing out that WP guideline, I was not aware of it. Noleander (talk)

(I'll pick up with Geological history next time)

@RoySmith: Thanks for the thoughtful, helpful suggestions. The article is better for them. Noleander (talk) 02:29, 4 May 2026 (UTC)

• The Nile is a relatively young river which evolved from ancestral river systems that followed significantly different courses. Over millions of years, tectonic and environmental forces shifted, separated, and merged rivers, eventually producing the current form of the river Nothing wrong with this per-se, but isn't that true of all rivers?

Done. Changed to "The Nile – like most rivers – evolved from ancestral river systems that followed significantly different courses. Over millions of years, tectonic and environmental forces shifted, separated, and merged rivers. The river assumed its current form relatively recently, about 15,000 years ago." The key point is that the Nile - unique among major rivers of the world - reached its current state only 15,000 years ago, which is the blink of an eye in geological terms. The new wording should clarify that. Noleander (talk) 16:03, 4 May 2026 (UTC)

• as a sequence of the following five evolutionary periods I'd drop "the following"; it seems a little, I don't know, self-referential?

Done. Noleander (talk) 16:03, 4 May 2026 (UTC)

• The repetition of starting paragraphs with "The Nth evolutionary period was ..." is stodgy. I suggest dropping that and just starting each paragraph with, for example, "Around 20 mya, the west flank ...". This would be a good place to use the bullet-list format described in MOS:EMBED.

Done. Removed repetitive wording; converted 5 paragr to bullet list style. Noleander (talk) 16:03, 4 May 2026 (UTC)

• The Nile led the Egyptians to build the world's first major dam I'm lery of "first" claims per endless examples at WP:DYK where such claims turned out to not stand up to scrutiny. How strong is this source? Would a bit of "according to ... the Sadd el-Kafara was the world's first major dam" make sense?

Done. I eliminated the word "first" and changed the wording to "The Nile led the Egyptians to build the world's earliest known major dam ..." [bold emphasis added]. As it happens, I'm currently working on the Dam article to improve it to FA status, and have read the authorities on dams, and 100% of them state that this is the world oldest known dam. Though, I suppose, some day an older one may be discovered. Noleander (talk) 16:03, 4 May 2026 (UTC)

• Kerma culture was originally a pastoral, cattle-oriented culture rephrase to eliminate the repetition of "culture".

Done. Changed to "Kerma culture was originally pastoral and cattle-oriented, but gradually shifted to agriculture as ... " Noleander (talk) 17:54, 4 May 2026 (UTC)

• Egypt from Roman era to colonial era this section is a bit scatter-shot. It starts out talking about Roman rule, then moves onto mostly canals and dams. The sentence about "Arab conquerors brought Islam to Egypt" drops in from nowhere.
  • Done. I improved that subsection so now it is now a coherent, chronological sequence of river-related events/achievements from circa 100 CE to circa 1800. I removed the "Arab conquerors" sentence since it is not directly related to the river. This subsection is tricky because prior to 100 CE there are many sources describing many events; likewise after 1800. But from 100 to 1800 the sources only provide a handful of unrelated events that are difficult to string together into a narrative. Noleander (talk) 18:08, 4 May 2026 (UTC)
• (see adjacent image) I'd drop that.

Done. Noleander (talk) 17:54, 4 May 2026 (UTC)

• The source of the White Nile proved to be more difficult to establish than that of the Blue Nile – Lake Victoria was not definitively established as a major source of the White Nile until 260 years after Gish Abay was identified as the Blue Nile's source. break this up into smaller sentences.

Done. Noleander (talk) 18:08, 4 May 2026 (UTC)

That's it for me, at least for a first reading. I'll keep an eye on this and probably come back for another look, but overall, this is very nice and I don't envision any problems. RoySmith (talk) 13:18, 4 May 2026 (UTC)

Thanks for the review, much appreciated. Noleander (talk) 18:09, 4 May 2026 (UTC)

Just one last thought. You've got a bunch of maps all based on File:Sources of the Nile.svg which include a red outline. The map in the infobox shows what appears to be the same area, only using color shading. I assume that delimits the Nile's watershed, or the extent of the flood plain, or some such? You should state this (of course, in a WP:ACCESS-compliant way). It's a little image-heavy in places, leading to some awkward layout problems, especially in the sections with tables, but I can't think of any images I'd actually want to lose so that may just be something we need to accept.

This is a really nice piece of work and it was a pleasure to read through it. Support based on the prose, i.e. WP:FACR 1a, 2a, and 2b. RoySmith (talk) 19:18, 5 May 2026 (UTC)

The issues I discuss below with the tables are severe enough that sadly I feel the need to (temporarily, I'm assuming) strike my support to make sure they get resolved before this closes. RoySmith (talk) 12:58, 7 May 2026 (UTC)

Yes, there are four images that all share the same background. The red line, as you supposed, delineates the Nile Basin. All four images explain that to readers with a textual label next to the red line stating "Boundary of the Nile Basin". (Credit to User:Amitchell125 who created the background map).

The map in the article's InfoBox is tricky: it has both the basin outline and elevation/topography data (various colors to indicate elevation of the terrain) yet neither of those are specified. Defining those features is hard to do in the InfoBox, since a large textual legend/caption would look ugly. So, the basin outline in that map is left undefined. Personally, I don't even like that map in the InfoBox, but a FA reviewer above wanted it added, so there it is.

The images in the article are not too cumbersome, I believe. Yes, there is a whitespace gap in section Nile#Sources and sinks: tributaries that is visible in desktop platforms. One way to remove that gap is to collapse the bottom four tables in that section. Those table are uncollapsed now, which makes the whitespace gap appear ... I can collapse those tables, if you want. I'm not aware of any other way to resolve that. That particular map is critical, because it defines the 12 water gauge stations that are the essence of in that section. Noleander (talk) 19:52, 5 May 2026 (UTC)

Looking closer at the tables, why not just combine the four tables in Sources and sinks: tributaries into one big table like I've got at Special:Permalink/1352979433? That would not only make it easier to read, but also take up less overall page real-estate since you wouldn't be duplicating the headers. On my laptop, two of the table wrap around the image and two are below it, so they get laid out differently and the columns don't even line up. On my phone, it's particularly bad; the tables are wider than the screen so you have to scroll and each table scrolls independently.

Done. Combined the four "tributary" tables into one table. Noleander (talk) 14:47, 7 May 2026 (UTC)

Do you really need the Source/Sink column? That information basically duplicates the sign of the "Water Bal" column. Also, why does the breakdown by geography include the extra "Discharge" column not present in the country breakdown table?

Done. Combined the two similar columns (Source/Sink and Water Balance) into one. They both had important data: one was a simple "Source" / "Sink" word that is the most important data in the entire table (quickly tells the reader which countries/regions are takers? which are contributors? of water). And the water bal. value shows the magnitude of what countries contribute/take the most. They are now merged into a single column. Noleander (talk) 14:47, 7 May 2026 (UTC)

Regarding the "Discharge" column: that data is defined only for the "tributary" tables (not the country table); i.e. it does not exist on a per-country basis. That Discharge data is fairly important because it shows how much water flows in the Nile at each point of the river, i.e. how the river grows as it moves along its course. Noleander (talk) 14:47, 7 May 2026 (UTC)

I get the desire to be comprehensive, but this is a lot of data: is it really necessary to present it all? It took me a while to figure out that the "(depth)" figures are just the water volumes in km^3 divided by the basin areas in km^2. Do we really need these? I get that they have some scientific value, but they don't really pull their weight in terms of the reader's overall understanding of the river vs the cost in visual clutter and layout issues. Dropping them would cut the vertical space used by the tables in half.

Done. Removed the "depth" millimeter data so all rows are now only a single-row of text tall. Noleander (talk) 14:47, 7 May 2026 (UTC)

My apologies for not picking up on these problems the first time through; I was concentrating on the prose and didn't look too hard at the tables. RoySmith (talk) 12:52, 7 May 2026 (UTC)

@RoySmith: No worries. All of the above concerns have been addressed, I believe. Noleander (talk) 14:47, 7 May 2026 (UTC)

PS, compare Special:Permalink/1352998461 with Special:Permalink/1352979433 RoySmith (talk) 14:57, 7 May 2026 (UTC)

Ah, we kind of cross-posted each other. What you've got now is pretty much what I was looking for, but do you still need the Discharge column in the geographic basin table? If they country table and the geographic table had the exact same headings, they would line up, making it easier for a reader to visually compare them. RoySmith (talk) 15:06, 7 May 2026 (UTC)

@RoySmith - Done. Removed the "Discharge" column from the tributary/basin table, so the two tables now have a similar column layout. Noleander (talk) 15:22, 7 May 2026 (UTC)

OK, that looks a lot cleaner, thanks. I may come back and do some more format tweaking on my own later, but Support restored, go forth and be featured. RoySmith (talk) 16:58, 7 May 2026 (UTC)

Thanks so much for the valuable suggestions. Feel free to make any formatting (or other) changes to the article ... any assistance is welcome. Noleander (talk) 17:19, 7 May 2026 (UTC)

I've started a thread at Help talk:Table. RoySmith (talk) 17:22, 7 May 2026 (UTC)

• Closing note: This candidate has been promoted, but there may be a delay in bot processing of the close. Please see WP:FAC/ar, and leave the {{featured article candidates}} template in place on the talk page until the bot goes through. Der Wohltemperierte Fuchs ^talk 21:35, 8 May 2026 (UTC)

The above discussion is preserved as an archive. Please do not modify it. No further edits should be made to this page.