Talk:Common European Framework of Reference for Languages
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The French aliance offers now 6 exams
The Frencha aliance offers now 6 exams based in this framework (b1, b2, etc...) although the ones mentioned in this page are still availabe. I think they should be included. ____
what does the asteriks behind the german language test mean?
Can someone explain it to mean. Additionally is there any international accepted german language test, like the american Toefl, or british Cambridge certificate.
--217.189.140.26 16:56, 20 October 2005 (UTC)
Unicert
Is there any other connection between UniCert and the CEF apart from the fact that UniCert is based on the framework? If not, is there any reason to mention UniCert particularly in this article, apart from in the table? Saint|swithin 10:11, 27 February 2006 (UTC)
- Unicert has already existed before CEF. This mapping is important for people who want to compare old UniCert certificates to CEF certificates and to people who want to enroll for a CEF-based language class but already got a UniCert certificate. -- 79.238.174.32 (talk) 22:41, 30 April 2012 (UTC)
Method of learning
New Page: Proficiency
How do you feel about creating a new page "Proficiency"? I would like to be able to compare different ideas of language proficience, as they vary between European, US, and other standards, and do not feel that either the Common European Framework of Reference for Languages or the ACTFL Proficiency Guidelines pages would be sufficient. (Note: I am cross-posting this to both discussion pages) samwaltz 00:30, 11 June 2006 (UTC)
- Actually, as I am asking around in other discussion pages (Japanese Language Proficiency Test), it makes sense to keep the discussion on one page. Looks like it's off to ACTFL for this thread.samwaltz 00:34, 11 June 2006 (UTC)
DELF/DALF
Why you didn't put the DELF/DALF in the frame? It is the principal French language certificate. (Diplôme d’Etudes en Langue Française DELF / A1 Diplôme d’Etudes en Langue Française DELF / A2 Diplôme d’Etudes en Langue Française DELF / B1 Diplôme d’Etudes en Langue Française DELF / B2 Diplôme Approfondi de Langue Française DALF / C1 Diplôme Approfondi de Langue Française DALF / C2 )
International Baccalaureate? anyone knows? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 130.241.192.37 (talk) 12:46, 31 August 2007 (UTC)
LCCI
The london Chamber of Commerce and Industry is doing a similar examination. I've done "English for Business - Level 3" and now I have a certificate that allows me to study on every english-speaking university without additional language-testing. I was said that Level 3 of the LCCI was similar to CEFR C1. I'm just not able to find any sources. Maybe somebody can help. Maweki 08:23, 13 July 2007 (UTC)
Criticism ?
I noticed that there is not a paragraph about any criticism. Has the CERFL ever been criticized in some way or other that deserves to be mentioned? Onaryc (talk) 15:12, 19 May 2008 (UTC)
German
German certificates included. 82.113.121.154 (talk) 07:20, 6 September 2009 (UTC)
TOEFL
UK/British equivalent
I have no idea what NVQ level means, but do understand what GCSE, AS and A level all mean I have tried searching the web but can't find anything to show how CEFR relates to these equivalent qualifications Please can someone add this to the table? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 80.218.215.119 (talk) 15:28, 24 September 2010 (UTC)
If you look up NVQ you will find the approximate academic qualifications according to the LSE (look up LSE if you don't know what that means). The NVQ page is the correct place for this information, not on every single other page that mentions NVQs. If you don't understand something, look it up. 190.55.119.13 (talk) 18:38, 13 February 2011 (UTC)Robert Jones
Someone has decided that mastery in european languages (C2) is equivalent to an AS level (Level 3 NVQ). This is clearly wrong as most foreign language students on their year abroad have only reached B2 or C1 level at best. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 83.54.25.55 (talk) 20:01, 25 February 2011 (UTC)
This appears to have been copied incorrectly from the given reference, and I've now updated the article to reflect it. Fish-Face (talk) 02:48, 2 March 2011 (UTC)
- I do not have a reference with which to back this up, but I have spent ten years living abroad since I was 18, and did pass my GCSE French with a grade A, back in the day. Having studied abroad I also realise the shocking tendency the UK has to consistently hugely overestimate the actual level of British qualifications, and this is another example. There is no way at all that an AS-level is equivalent to level B2. Most tests, like Norsk III, the NT2 Statsexamen (NL) and the SWEDEX one takes to demonstrate proficiency are at level B2, and at least anyone I know with an AS in language or indeed the full A-Level, or A2 or whatever they call them these days, would have been able to pass those kinds of tests... I think someone that showed particular interest, and scored an A in their A2 might have a chance at it, but even that would not be a sure thing. I cannot back that up, but I am not "unqualified" not least because I have done tests like those myself.
- This table suggests that if I went to into the lowest "set" for French at a local comprehensive, the kids in there would be able to speak French, at level A2, that is:
- Can understand sentences and frequently used expressions related to areas of most immediate relevance (e.g. very basic personal and family information, shopping, local geography, employment). Can communicate in simple and routine tasks requiring a simple and direct exchange of information on familiar and routine matters. Can describe in simple terms aspects of his/her background, immediate environment and matters in areas of immediate need.
- As it is written in this same article. I can tell you, certain-sure, that while one might have described MY French this way, when I had finished my GCSEs, one would already have been generous. The idea that the ones AIMING at a grade "D" at GCSE could be described this way, in my view (especially in the spoken language) is pretty far-fetched, no matter what we WISH were the case. Does anyone actually disagree with me in this, forgetting for a second the wishful thinking?
- Please consider the following:
http://www3.open.ac.uk/study/undergraduate/course/l192.htm
- "This course will enable you to reach a level of language proficiency comparable to GCSE level (grades A*–C), Scottish standard Grades 1 and 2, and Council of Europe level A2 (see Common European Framework of Reference for Languages for further details). In all other respects – for example, cultural awareness and analytical skills – you will be working towards Level 1 undergraduate outcomes."
- In commentary, I have not critically evaluated the above, and personally I think it remains optimistic in practice if anything, however given that the OU is a reputable institution, and that the previous reference number 12 seems to no longer exist, I propose that the equivalences be modified at the very least to show that GCSE higher tier is A2 rather than this being foundation tier, and that AS level is at most B1 level.
It appears my changes have been reversed without countering the above discussion about why the changes were made. Simple statements contradicting these discussions won't do I feel, especially as the practical evidence simply doesn't support the claim that an A-Level (at any grade!) Means fluency, as it clearly does not, while level B2 does seem to imply basic fluency. Given the credible reference I provided, where even a UK institution admits that A-Level is B1 level, I feel this has to be answered. Princeofdelft (talk) — Preceding unsigned comment added by 86.179.170.163 (talk) 20:50, 21 January 2012 (UTC)
Having inspected other references I will add the following defence of the above:
At the Open University, an accredited and high ranking UK institution, one is expected to be able to get a B.A. in modern languages by attaining level C1 proficiency in two foreign languages, in principle from a "standing start". If we assume, as the OU says, that A-Level qualifications give a maximum level of B1, then one's first year would be effectively plain sailing, on the condition that one had good results from one's A-Levels, in say, French, German, and some other subject. Unlike other European countries, Britain sees fit to award degrees the first year of which is essentially trivial in difficulty, at least when the right A-Levels have been studied (which is generally a requirement). Because, according to the OU, the A2 level, and B1 level courses are a half-semester (30 uk credits, 15 ECTS credits ) each, two languages means one year.
B1 to B2 progression, takes six months. If we assume A-Levels are B2 level, then we are saying that effectively only ONE year of studying beyond A-Level (not two) allows one to claim a degree in languages from a reputable institution in the UK. This is beyond even the UK's abiltity to award degrees easily, and I see it as proof that the A-Level=B2 hypothesis is discredited.
Princeofdelft (talk) —Preceding undated comment added 01:31, 2 February 2012 (UTC).
It seems to have been missed that the table on the Cambridge English website equates the *difficulty* of obtaining their C2 qualification with the difficulty of an A-Level. It does not claim that getting an A-Level indicates C2-level proficiency. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 84.51.148.57 (talk) 21:37, 24 June 2020 (UTC)
I updated the page with a reliable source for GCSE grades, but the AQA AS-/A-Level FAQ explicitly states that they AS-Levels and A-Levels are not mapped to the CEFR.