User talk:Anthony Mugan

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Suggestion to collaborate on new biographical page re: Paul R Hill

"First can I apologise if this is not the correct way to communicate on Wikipedia - this is my first 'edit' and one thing I am sure of is that I haven't got my head around how this is supposed to work yet! I was disappointed to miss the debate on the Paul Hill page deletion. I searched for something about him yesterday and found the page then, and was reflecting on my possible comments overnight, but I was evidently too late. I would be happy to collaborate on a new biographical entry for Hill, but would struggle to do the actual drafting (other than in Word and then sending it to someone who actually understands how this site works!). My impression is that Hill's notability rests in part on his contribution to the developmnent of the US space programme and other elements of his work as an aerodynamacist, which would be of specialist interest to students of the history of the space programme, and of engineering, but to a greater extent on his book ' Unconventional Flying Objects'. The point to me is not if one agrees with Hill's conclusion concerning the ETH or not, nor if that conclusion is controversial or not (the range of topics in the latter category is considerable), but rather that the work is widely referenced by others in the debate concerning UFOs and so biographical information concerning the author would be of interest to this group also. I do not know how this fits the precise criteria of the site, but...Perhaps more significantly I did feel that the original article could have been developed. It would have benefited from many of the references to Hill's engineering and research work you located, and from reducing the amount of content from his book that was included. An important point would be to note the controverial and generally unaccepted status of the ETH and Hill's hypotheses (Condon and Gilmore, 1968 etc. might suffice, although I can't see any specific skeptical reference against Hill's actual work). This could be balanced by noting some of the prominent scientists that have supported the ETH, as you described, such as Hynek, Sturrock, (perhaps also the Deardoff et al 2005 paper in JBIS...?. I will pop back to look at this page over the next few days to see if this idea might be relevance for you. Once again apologise if I have inadevertantly breached any protocols." Anthony Mugan (talk) 10:31, 19 January 2011 (UTC)Anthony Mugan

Anthony, thanks for the offer of help. Wish you could have been there for the debate on Hill. This was always about a handful of skeptics purging Wikipedia of hated UFO-related content, not whether Hill was prominent or not or whether there were third party sources. The two main people pushing for deletion were simultaneously pushing for deletion of about a dozen other people associated with Ufology, including some very prominent ones. I was in the process of modifying the article to address some of the complaints, when the article got deleted underneath me. Wikipedia is frustratingly difficult to edit with its millions of complicated protocols, so don't feel too bad about not understanding them. Neither do I. I am in the process of appealing the delete, but in the meantime am looking for third-party biographies on Hill to build a new biography around. One I'm picking up tomorrow from the library. (Who's Who in Engineering, 1989). There is another one that just got published last November and I can't find anywhere yet that may be more promising, American Aerospace Engineers, where Hill is profiled along with about 100 other major contributors to American aerospace engineering. These are big names, like the Wright brothers. So that alone should deal with issue of notability.
My plan is to base Hill's aerospace biography around these third party sources and rely only minimally on Hill's own biographical information, though I have yet to find a problem with it. Everything I've found from other sources checks out. New sections I was trying to add were a list of his technical publications and his patents, which can be found on the Net.
Regarding his book, maybe a mention can be made of it in his biography, plus the fact it is widely cited in the Ufology literature. But perhaps any detailed discussion of the contents or Hill's sightings should be in a separate article devoted exclusively to the book. Hill's first sighting is already documented because Hill reported it to the AF's Project Blue Book.Dr Fil (talk) 03:02, 20 January 2011 (UTC)

Paul R Hill - possible draft

Paul R Hill

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