Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Mayhem on the Beach

Mayhem on the Beach

Mayhem on the Beach (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) – (View log | edits since nomination)

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This article should be merged into the album page, as the event is not (yet) notable enough to warrant its own article. Lady Gaga is also performing a promotional concert in Mexico City, making it unlikely that this show is uniquely significant. Additionally, as the article itself states, "Niemeyer also confirmed that Lady Gaga will debut a brand-new show, which will premiere earlier at Coachella in April." This further supports that the performance is part of a broader promotional concert series spanning multiple countries rather than a distinct event. Given the uncertainty regarding whether these shows are part of an actual concert tour, maintaining a separate article at this stage is premature.

Furthermore, the article includes lines like, "Events of this scale offer multiple benefits to the city, both economically and in terms of tourism and image, highlighting the best that Rio de Janeiro has to offer." This kind of language makes it sound more like a puff piece from the country's tourism department rather than an encyclopedic entry. Sricsi (talk) 20:44, 3 March 2025 (UTC)

Just as an update: Gaga now has announced 2 concerts in Mexico City, and 4 in Singapore, all of them with very similar promotional material as this one event in Brazil. --Sricsi (talk) 10:04, 12 March 2025 (UTC)

• Note: This discussion has been included in the list of Music-related deletion discussions. Sricsi (talk) 20:44, 3 March 2025 (UTC)
• Note: This discussion has been included in the deletion sorting lists for the following topics: Events and Brazil. Shellwood (talk) 21:33, 3 March 2025 (UTC)

Keep : I believe that Mayhem on the Beach warrants its own article due to its distinct characteristics and significance. While Lady Gaga is performing multiple promotional concerts for Mayhem, the Rio de Janeiro event stands out for several reasons. Unlike the Long Live Mayhem concert in Mexico, which is a standard ticketed show, Mayhem on the Beach is a free, large-scale event organized as part of Todo Mundo no Rio. This distinction is relevant, as it affects the accessibility, audience reach, and organizational structure of the concert. While Long Live Mayhem is directly produced by Gaga’s team in collaboration with Live Nation Entertainment, Mayhem on the Beach is integrated into a broader cultural initiative with its own independent framework. Removing the standalone article would overlook this context and its relevance to Todo Mundo no Rio. Additionally, the concert is expected to attract over one million attendees, making it one of Gaga’s largest performances and a major entertainment event in Brazil. Similar large-scale promotional concerts, such as Madonna: Tears of a Clown and ArtRave, have warranted separate articles, establishing a precedent for events of this nature.

Per Wikipedia’s notability guidelines, concerts and live events merit independent articles when they are widely covered by reliable sources, hold cultural or historical significance, and differ from standard promotional performances. Mayhem on the Beach meets these criteria due to its scale, media coverage, and integration into Todo Mundo no Rio. If the concern is that this concert is part of a broader promotional tour, a better approach would be to expand the article rather than merge it. If necessary, its inclusion within the Todo Mundo no Rio page could be considered, but simply merging it into the Mayhem album article would diminish its distinct context and significance. That line "Events of this scale offer multip..." is a direct quotation from the CEO of the company responsible for bringing Lady Gaga to Brazil, stated in the context of the event’s production and the reasoning behind selecting her as the headlining artist. The article also includes statements from the Mayor of Rio de Janeiro and the Secretary of Culture, which further emphasize the scale and significance of this concert for both the city and the Todo Mundo no Rio initiative. These quotes provide essential context on the economic, cultural, and touristic impact of the event, which has been widely covered by reliable sources. While the wording can certainly be adjusted or shortened, the information itself adds valuable context to the article. Additionally, these statements serve as a foundation for further coverage, as more details and perspectives from organizers, officials, and media outlets will emerge as the event approaches. Over time, the article will naturally expand to include sections on commercial performance, critical reception, and other post-event analyses, making these initial citations an important starting point.--CHr0m4tiko0 (talk) 23:38, 3 March 2025 (UTC)

Your comparisons don't quite add up. ArtRave was an exclusive two-day event created specifically for Lady Gaga's Artpop album release, while Tears of a Clown was a one-of-a-kind performance designed for Madonna's Australian audience. There's no indication that this upcoming Brazilian concert will resemble either of those.

The only valid comparison is Madonna’s free concert in Brazil, which also drew significant attention but doesn’t have its own article. That event ultimately served as the final show of her Celebration Tour, rather than a standalone production.

Given the promotional material for Gaga’s Mexico City performance, it appears these concerts may be part of a broader promotional tour. However, at this point, it's all speculation—falling under WP:CRYSTAL. Sricsi (talk) 08:38, 4 March 2025 (UTC)

I used ArtRave and Tears of a Clown as models for structuring the article rather than claiming Mayhem on the Beach is identical to them. When I first created this page, the Mexico City concert hadn't been announced, and even now, it differs significantly as a ticketed event, whereas Mayhem on the Beach is a large-scale free concert organized as part of Todo Mundo no Rio. Coachella, on the other hand, is part of an established festival and follows a different framework altogether. As of now, a Mayhem tour has not been announced. Gaga has historically named her tours following a specific format (album name + Ball Tour), and when she launches a new era, she typically announces full tours with substantial lead time. While these performances may share the same production and setlist, they are currently positioned as a series of standalone promotional concerts rather than a structured tour.

If the concern is that Mayhem on the Beach should not be treated in isolation, a reasonable alternative could be revising the title or consolidating all three concerts into a single article. However, outright merging it into the album page doesn’t seem appropriate, as there is significant sourced material specific to Mayhem on the Beach that wouldn't naturally fit within an album article. CHr0m4tiko0 (talk) 15:11, 4 March 2025 (UTC)

Keep: I do think that the page article should be renamed per WP:MV, condensing the shows held at Coachella, Mexico City and Rio de Janeiro as a Mayhem promotional tour, similarly to the Dive Bar Tour. Bichota B (talk) 16:00, 4 March 2025 (UTC)

Delete: Agreed. The event isn’t notable enough for its own article, and seems to be just one stopover of a larger promo run. Plus some of the language does make it read like an ad for the city (Rio). Merge it to Mayhem (Lady Gaga album). Kirtap92 (talk) 07:01, 6 March 2025 (UTC)

Hi @Kirtap92. My intention was never to make the article read like an advertisement for Rio. The inclusion of statements from government officials and event organizers was meant to provide context for why Lady Gaga was chosen to headline and to illustrate the scale of the Todo Mundo no Rio initiative. However, I understand the concern about tone, and I’m open to revising the wording to ensure neutrality while maintaining the relevant sourced information. The event’s significance is well-documented, and it differs from a standard promotional stop due to its unique structure, free admission, and integration into a larger cultural initiative. If necessary, adjustments can be made to improve the article, but outright merging it into the album page would erase valuable context. CHr0m4tiko0 (talk) 15:01, 7 March 2025 (UTC)

You replied to this editor that you are ready to "revise" and "adjust" the article that you created, but I don't see you making any effort. Since you voted for "Keep", maybe you should focus your energy on this, instead of overloading the Mayhem (Lady Gaga album) article with excessive text. Sricsi (talk) 14:19, 22 March 2025 (UTC)

Delete: This kind of article isn't comparable to Madonna's Tears of a Clown show at all, in fact the only standard it can be compared to is Madonna's performance also on Copacabana Beach, which doesn't have an article of its own. As Shellwood noted, the existence of the Mexico show implies she's doing a mini Mayhem Ball for LATAM specifically, so to single out the Bracil show doesn't make any sense. I think it should be deleted until the show happens and maybe the coverage will ramp up to warrant notability.PHShanghai | they/them (talk) 04:34, 8 March 2025 (UTC)

Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, Liz ^{Read! Talk!} 22:42, 10 March 2025 (UTC)

Keep : Firstly, the article and the event are not directly linked to the Mayhem album. Mayhem on The Beach is a promotional name created by the singer's team to promote the album internationally, while the event's original name is Todo Mundo no Rio: Lady Gaga. Therefore, associating the article with the Mayhem album no longer makes sense, as it was merely a promotional title. Secondly, the event is part of Todo Mundo no Rio and not a concert from Lady Gaga's tour. It is more like a special edition of a festival, featuring exclusive content and having no connection to the Mayhem Tour.

Vazafirst (talk) 22:20, 11 March 2025 (UTC)

Then move this show to Todo Mundo Na Rio-there's no precedence for this article to have its own article. How do we know it's going to have "exclusive" content though? Isn't it all the more likely the setlist will be the same for Mexico, Singapore and Brazil since they're all promoting the same album? PHShanghai | they/them (talk) 10:50, 12 March 2025 (UTC)

Keep : However, I do believe that the title should be moved to Mayhem (promotional tour) and the article itself should comprise as well the performances held at Coachella, Mexico City and Singapore. Bezarista Number One (talk) 18:42, 13 March 2025 (UTC)

I agree with this proposal. Moving the article to Mayhem (promotional tour) would allow for a more comprehensive overview of these performances while still maintaining space to discuss the specifics of each location. This way, the significance of Mayhem on the Beach within Todo Mundo no Rio can still be properly contextualized, alongside the shows in Mexico City, Singapore, and Coachella. CHr0m4tiko0 (talk) 04:10, 14 March 2025 (UTC)

Agree with this. Please include the Mexico City and Singapore shows in this article. The performances are presumed to be similar (if not identical) to each other anyway. TenthAvenueFreezeOut (talk) 16:49, 18 March 2025 (UTC)

Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
Relisting comment: Still no clear consensus following previous relisting on 10 March
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, Spartathenian (talk) 09:45, 18 March 2025 (UTC)

Keep per Bezarista Number One. HorrorLover555 (talk) 16:52, 19 March 2025 (UTC)

Keep as article has been expanded, and continues to be expanded to meet the qualifications of meeting several notability standards. livelikemusic (TALK!) 15:46, 22 March 2025 (UTC)

• Keep ---Another Believer _(Talk) 14:31, 25 March 2025 (UTC)

The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.