I even asked chat gbt which clarified that it has never been conquered by then The writer fixer (talk) 14:05, 27 November 2024 (UTC)
- "even chat GBT". Lol. Looks like there were periods of control under Tudḫaliya IV and Šuppiluliuma II.. DeCausa (talk) 14:46, 27 November 2024 (UTC)
- The article says: "
Hattusili's son... even temporarily annexed the island of Cyprus, before that too fell to Assyria.[1]
" I'm not sure why you would assume that you asking chat GPT was more reliable than Nowacki and Lefèvre (2009). Martinevans123 (talk) 18:59, 27 November 2024 (UTC)
References
Horst Nowacki, Wolfgang Lefèvre Creating Shapes in Civil and Naval Architecture: A Cross-Disciplinary Comparison Brill, 2009 ISBN 9004173455
Oh my, oh my. I tried to edit this. Only to be turned down by someone higher up on the Wikipedia totem pole. I was requested to explain my edit using Talk. I can see I am not the first to post on this either.
This statement should be corrected in the article:
“He even temporarily annexed the island of Cyprus, before that too fell to Assyria.” Referring to Tudhaliya IV.
To my knowledge, this is historically wrong.
Trevor Bryce’s The Kingdom Of The Hittites describes the military activities of Tudhaliya IV on Cyprus in the following way, quote:
- “Information about the campaign appears on a tablet from the reign of his son Suppiluliuma II [...]”
Said tablet translated (source Bryce):
- “I seized the king of Alasiya with his wives, his children, [and his]. All the goods, including silver and gold, and all the captured people I removed and brought home to Hattusa. I enslaved the country of Alasiya, and made it tributary on the spot. (KUB xii 38 i, 3–8, after Güterbock (1967a: 77))”
Tudhaliya IV reigned c. 1245–1215 BC. Tukulti-Ninurta I, the Middle Assyrian king who supposedly took control of Cyprus reigned c. 1243–1207 BC. Wikipedia’s article on Tukulti-Ninurta states that he captured Babylonia, and invaded the Arabian Peninsula, conquering the pre-Arab states of Dilmun and Meluhha. No historical research connects him to Cyprus. In order to conquer Cyprus a fleet of ships would have been necessary and a port to assemble the fleet. Correct? Tudhaliya IV had an ally in Ugarit, a small vassal kingdom and port (destroyed c. 1185 BC) in what is today Syria. My proposed edit:
- Remove: ‘[...] before that too fell to Assyria.’
- Revise: ‘[...] probably with naval assistance from Ugarit.’
Note the word ‘probably’ in my version. It is dubious to claim that Assyria conquered Cyprus.
Trevor Bryce’s The Kingdom Of The Hittites sets out that Cyprus/Alasiya was a bone of contention between Ahhiyawa (Mycenean) and the Hittites going back to at least the reign of Arnuwanda I (c. 1390–1380/1370 BC). There was then a crisis involving a rebellious Hittite vassal Madduwatta who repeatedly raided Cyprus. Arnuwanda wrote to him and Madduwatta’s reply was this:
- “The Land of Alasiya is a Land of My Sun (wrote Arnuwanda) and brings him tribute. Why have you taken it?’ But Madduwatta spoke thus: ‘When Attar(i)ssiya and the Man of Piggaya were raiding the Land of Alasiya, I often raided it too. But the father of My Sun did not subsequently write to me, the father of My Sun never signified to me: ‘The Land of Alasiya is mine. Acknowledge it as this!’ If now My Sun demands back the prisoners taken from Alasiya, I will give them back to him. (Indictment §36, rev. 85–9)”
Here, during a much earlier dispute, the problem for the Hittites may have been that they needed ships to assert control over Cyprus. Madduwatta and Attarissiya were better situated.
Note on Attarissiya. The name ‘probably’ (that word again) is related to LinB. a-ta-ra-si-jo, ‘without copper’ — a self-sufficient smith, able to obtain his own copper. Its LinB. opposite was ta-ra-si-ja, ‘with copper’ — a smith depending on palace copper. The implication of the name seems to be that Attarissiya had a vested interest in Cypriot copper. Tudhaliya IV’s annexation would not have pleased Ahhiyawa. Speculation perhaps, but the Greeks did go to enormous trouble to build a fortress at Kition on Cyprus, dated to about the time Ugarit was destroyed by Sea Peoples, c. 1185 BC. An exchange of letters from Ammurapi, last king of Ugarit, and the viceroy of Carchemish sheds light on the disaster about to unfold. The viceroy wrote Ammurapi (source Bryce):
- “As for what you have written to me: ‘Ships of the enemy have been seen at sea!’ Well, you must remain firm. Indeed for your part, where are your troops, your chariots stationed? Are they not stationed near you? No? Behind the enemy, who press upon you? Surround your towns with ramparts. Have your troops and chariots enter there, and await the enemy with great resolution! (RSL 1 = Nougayrol et al. (1968: 85–6 no. 23))”
Assyria did not take control of Alasiya until centuries later. From Wikipedia:
- “The town of Kition, now Larnaca, recorded part of the ancient history of Cyprus on a stele that commemorated a victory by Sargon II (722–705 BC) of Assyria there in 709 BC.”
Finally, allow me to say this, on a somewhat personal note. My late father, H. Nowacki, is among the sources listed for the Hittite article. Footnote 71. Context:
- “The last king, Šuppiluliuma II also managed to win some victories, including a naval battle against Alashiya off the coast of Cyprus.”
My father and a colleague of his researched naval battles in a published book. I can no longer ask him, but we had a talk about it once; my father felt, like do I, that Ugarit was involved, conspiring with the Hittites against an enemy. Ahhiyawa, the Myceneans, Sea Peoples?
My edit stands: ‘[...] probably with naval assistance from Ugarit.’
I made the suggested edit on 29 May, 2026. TN — Preceding unsigned comment added by TnbniceR (talk • contribs) 15:34, 29 May 2026 (UTC)
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