Talk:Kemp House

The following is a closed discussion of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. Editors desiring to contest the closing decision should consider a move review after discussing it on the closer's talk page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

The result of the move request was: Not moved There is consensus that this isn't the primary topic for "Mission House". There was insufficient discussion about what name to use given that to come to a consensus; that can be brought to a new discussion * Pppery * _{it has begun...} 20:45, 26 March 2026 (UTC)

Kerikeri Mission House → Mission House – Undiscussed move, also the disambiguation page should be moved back too. Whilst the Kerikeri one may not be the PTOPIC this should still be discussed as there is good argument with the Kerikeri building being the oldest building in New Zealand Traumnovelle (talk) 20:50, 11 March 2026 (UTC) This is a contested technical request (permalink). 162 etc. (talk) 16:39, 13 March 2026 (UTC)

Unlikely that this is the primary topic. Mission House as a dabpage appears to make sense here. 162 etc. (talk) 20:54, 11 March 2026 (UTC)

That doesn't matter, it was originally at this title for a long time and has been moved without discussion. It should go to an RM. I don't understand why this has been moved to 'contested technical requests', this is a request to revert an undiscussed move, not a technical request that has been contested. Traumnovelle (talk) 05:07, 12 March 2026 (UTC)

The comment technically contests the request. 1isall (talk | contribs) 13:31, 12 March 2026 (UTC)

So? A user without any discussed moved Mission House to Kerikeri Mission House. The article had been at the title for 20 years. Per WP:RMUM I have contested this move and so it should be reverted back to the status quo, with any change having to go through a proper requested move. Traumnovelle (talk) 19:32, 12 March 2026 (UTC)

• It's fine if the revert happens, but the title should continue to be discussed. Perhaps the revert should be performed and the RM should be converted to a renaming proposal by 162. —⁠ ⁠BarrelProof (talk) 17:15, 13 March 2026 (UTC)

  Yeah, there's clearly some different opinions regarding this, and we're all here. Let's discuss. 162 etc. (talk) 19:48, 13 March 2026 (UTC)

Why is this an RM? The title has been here for 20 years. If someone wants to change it they have the WP:ONUS to get consensus. Traumnovelle (talk) 19:13, 13 March 2026 (UTC)

Yes, that's right. The move can be reverted. The discussion should continue. The onus is on those who want the title to be different from "Mission House". —⁠ ⁠BarrelProof (talk) 21:04, 13 March 2026 (UTC)

• Move to Kerikeri Mission House. "Mission House" is ambiguous and should be the title of the dabpage. 162 etc. (talk) 19:48, 13 March 2026 (UTC)

• Support Kerikeri Mission House. Or perhaps Kerikeri Mission Station or Kemp House (Kerikeri) or Kerikeri Mission. Out of the four sources cited in the article, one calls it "Kerikeri Mission House" and says it is also known as the "Kemp House", and one calls it "Kerikeri Mission" and also calls it "Kemp House". There is a photo in the article with a sign outside labelling the place as "Kerikeri Mission Station". I can't access the other two (one seems to be a broken/dead link and the other requires a subscription). Looking at Mission House (disambiguation) and performing a web search for the term, I see that there are many topics that can be referred to as "Mission House". A pageview comparison is here. This one gets the most readers on average, but in a couple of months in recent years there have been more readers of Moravian Brethren Mission House, and the overall impression is that the term seems overly generic without some indication of the location. The Mission House in Kerikeri does not get more readership than the others combined, even without including the First Mission House and the Old Mission House. It doesn't even get more readership than the next three combined. It was in the Kemp family for 142 years and also has a sign calling it the Kemp House, and the Kemps are who donated it to the heritage trust. —⁠ ⁠BarrelProof (talk) 21:23, 13 March 2026 (UTC)

'Kerikeri Mission House' is not the common name for the building see NZ Herald

Given this is the oldest building in New Zealand there is an argument for being primary in long term significance in addition to the fact this is the most viewed article on the DAB page. Traumnovelle (talk) 02:38, 14 March 2026 (UTC)

I also have thoughts. Regarding common name, I left a message on wbm1058's talk page that Heritage New Zealand is very bad at naming their entries? They often do not reflect a common name. Hence, it's no good using their naming conventions as a rationale for page moves. (note it was that user who moved the page) Regarding process, when an undiscussed move turns out to be controversial, in my view the best way forward is to revert the move and then start a move discussion. wbm1058, would you be so kind and self-revert the move? Schwede66 03:40, 14 March 2026 (UTC)

I'm not sure I see what those three links are intended to demonstrate. It seems to find all three names used in the NZ Herald, such as one article whose first mention of the topic in the article body is "A penny dated 1806, complete with images of George II and Brittania, had been uncovered at the Kerikeri Mission House in Northland." There are also similar phrases such as Kerikeri's Mission House. Also, we should keep in mind that WP:HEADLINES are not reliable sources, for multiple reasons. Moreover, when assessing the primary topic question, it is important to consider sources outside of New Zealand. —⁠ ⁠BarrelProof (talk) 18:20, 14 March 2026 (UTC)

Kemp House is the most common name on the search results, and yes 'Kerikeri Mission House' has false positives like that. Traumnovelle (talk) 20:37, 14 March 2026 (UTC)

• Oppose. No primary topic. -- Necrothesp (talk) 16:45, 18 March 2026 (UTC)