Talk:444 East 58th Street

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444 East 58th Street is currently an Art and architecture good article nominee. Nominated by - OpalYosutebito 『talk』『articles I want to eat』 at 01:08, 8 June 2026 (UTC)

This article is ready to be reviewed in accordance with the good article criteria. Any editor who has not nominated or contributed significantly to this article may review the article and decide if it should be listed as a good article. To start the review process, click start review and then save the page. See the instructions.

444 East 58th Street was nominated as a Art and architecture good article, but it did not meet the good article criteria at the time (June 1, 2026, reviewed version). There are suggestions on the review page for improving the article. If you can improve it, please do; it may then be renominated.

444 East 58th Street was nominated as a Art and architecture good article, but it did not meet the good article criteria at the time (November 1, 2025, reviewed version). There are suggestions on the review page for improving the article. If you can improve it, please do; it may then be renominated.

444 East 58th Street was nominated as a Art and architecture good article, but it did not meet the good article criteria at the time (October 21, 2025, reviewed version). There are suggestions on the review page for improving the article. If you can improve it, please do; it may then be renominated.

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GA review

Unsuccessful. Z1720 (talk) 01:20, 21 October 2025 (UTC)

The following discussion is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

This review is transcluded from Talk:444 East 58th Street/GA1. The edit link for this section can be used to add comments to the review.

Nominator: Danifel (talk · contribs) 17:38, 19 October 2025 (UTC)

Reviewer: Z1720 (talk · contribs) 01:20, 21 October 2025 (UTC)

Thank you for nominating this article. Unfortunately, I am going to quick-fail this article due to numerous uncited statements, including the entire "Façade" section and numerous statements in the "Tenants and demographics". Typically, good articles will have a citation at the end of every paragraph, minimum. When this is resolved this article can be renominated. Z1720 (talk) 01:20, 21 October 2025 (UTC)

The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

GA review

Unsuccessful. - OpalYosutebito 『talk』『articles I want to eat』 00:03, 1 November 2025 (UTC)

The following discussion is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

This review is transcluded from Talk:444 East 58th Street/GA2. The edit link for this section can be used to add comments to the review.

Nominator: Danifel (talk · contribs) 21:30, 25 October 2025 (UTC)

Reviewer: OpalYosutebito (talk · contribs) 17:17, 30 October 2025 (UTC)

I'm going to be bold and start reviewing! I'm going off of this revision, for reference

Why are there so many inline references in the lead? If I'm not mistaken, references should only be in the lead if there's a particularly contentious claim.
A lot of subsections in the history section are really short. Either expand on them or merge them into fewer sections, please.
Lawrence Berliner (1928-1928) seems pretty redundant to me. You can just say "Lawrence Berliner (1928)" and it would have the same meaning... - OpalYosutebito 『talk』『articles I want to eat』 17:17, 30 October 2025 (UTC)

I'm looking at this further and the problems with inline references persist into the rest of the article. For instance, the second paragraph in the "Façade" section calls reference 2 seven times, when it should only call the reference once (at the end of the paragraph) - OpalYosutebito 『talk』『articles I want to eat』 17:19, 30 October 2025 (UTC)

You cite Wikipedia in reference 39. This isn't allowed because Wikipedia is a user-generated source, per WP:CIRCULAR
446 East 58th Street went into an auction don't you mean 444 East 58th Street went into an auction? If the building got renamed, please let me know, otherwise, please fix the typo - OpalYosutebito 『talk』『articles I want to eat』 17:23, 30 October 2025 (UTC)

These parts don't have an inline citation accompanying them:

and was acquired by Joseph B Bloomingdale.
With that, Abraham Levy & Isaac Haft were able to consolidate ownership of both properties, and could build the current 444-446 East 58th Street (as called originally), architected by George F. Pelham.
when the property was sold to Lawrence T. Berliner.
until 1982, Nicholas Zurla's companies (or companies belonging to his heirs, as he died in 1978), controlled the building, still as a rental building.
Although little is known about its subsequent history, the shop reflected the cultural development of Sutton Place during the interwar years, when the district was attracting affluent residents and small literary ventures.

More edit requests:

444 and 446 East Fifty-eighth Street to 444 and 446 East 58th Street
on 444 E 58th Street and on 446 E 58th Street wouldn't on 444 and 446 E 58th Street be less redundant?
Close by Riverview Garden had also been erected sounds awkward. Either adding a comma after "by" or Riverview Garden had also been erected nearby could work a little better
I've tagged the article with "use mdy dates" and "American English", and I'll help you update the dates and language accordingly - OpalYosutebito 『talk』『articles I want to eat』 18:13, 30 October 2025 (UTC)

FamilySearch (as seen in citations 11 and 52-55) is not a reliable source; see WP:FAMILYSEARCH - OpalYosutebito 『talk』『articles I want to eat』 00:30, 31 October 2025 (UTC)

Do you have a link for Writer's Digest, vol. 17, no. 5 (May 1937), p. 50, listing for Lou Sheppard, 444 East 58th Street, New York City, via Internet Archive.? - OpalYosutebito 『talk』『articles I want to eat』 00:43, 31 October 2025 (UTC)

As of 1815, the 444 East 58th Street area was farmland. this doesn't make sense to me. Would Until 1815 make more chronological sense? - OpalYosutebito 『talk』『articles I want to eat』 00:52, 31 October 2025 (UTC)

Comment/Question: Reference 2 is a photograph of the facade with no accompanying text. Therefore, does using this as a reference for text constitute original research? the entire section seems to be a Wikipedia user describing what they see in the photograph with no input from reliable sources at all. Gb321 (talk) 22:24, 31 October 2025 (UTC)

Yeah, it does sound like original research to me. Images shouldn't really be used as references without any sort of accompanying text from a third party describing them... - OpalYosutebito 『talk』『articles I want to eat』 23:44, 31 October 2025 (UTC)

Until the citation issues are resolved, I'm going to have to fail this article. I'll still be around to help, though... - OpalYosutebito 『talk』『articles I want to eat』 00:03, 1 November 2025 (UTC)

The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

Feedback

Hi! I've noticed five sources that share this text: "Deed". ACRIS. Retrieved September 21, 2025. While these correspond to different links, could someone please find more specific/unique names for each source? Thanks! - OpalYosutebito 『talk』『articles I want to eat』 22:15, 1 November 2025 (UTC)

I also found a source that definitively calls the building "Beaux-Arts" - OpalYosutebito 『talk』『articles I want to eat』 22:20, 1 November 2025 (UTC)

Nice, lets add it! Danifel (talk) 16:58, 7 December 2025 (UTC)

What does this sentence have to do with the 1950 census? In 1961, the University of Virginia's *Alumnae News* reported that recent graduate Patty Moffitt had moved into an apartment at 444 East 58th Street while beginning work at First National City Bank. - OpalYosutebito 『talk』『articles I want to eat』 02:50, 12 November 2025 (UTC)

Hi! The article is looking better since the last review. However, I believe the rental prices in the "From the Great Depression onwards as a rental building: 1928 to 1984" section could be converted to table format and made into its own section. Is that alright with you, too? - OpalYosutebito 『talk』『articles I want to eat』 04:15, 7 December 2025 (UTC)

Yes, fine by me, no problem at all! Danifel (talk) 16:57, 7 December 2025 (UTC)

I'll get to work once I get to a computer :) - OpalYosutebito 『talk』『articles I want to eat』 17:04, 7 December 2025 (UTC)

@Danifel I noticed that two sources (citations 16 and 17) look very similar:

"REAL ESTATE TRANSFERS". The New York Times. March 9, 1901. ProQuest 96079777.
"REAL ESTATE TRANSFERS". The New York Times. Retrieved October 3, 2025.

Do you have a link to the first one, or should I merge the two sources? - OpalYosutebito 『talk』『articles I want to eat』 16:50, 7 December 2025 (UTC)

You are right, my mistake, you can merge the sources, probably NY Times archives is better than ProQuest Danifel (talk) 16:56, 7 December 2025 (UTC)

I kept both links just in case :D - OpalYosutebito 『talk』『articles I want to eat』 15:18, 8 December 2025 (UTC)

Fun fact: you can access ProQuest through the Wikipedia Library if you meet certain criteria (not blocked, have a certain number of edits, etc) - OpalYosutebito 『talk』『articles I want to eat』 15:18, 8 December 2025 (UTC)

@Danifel the article mentions "Holland". Is this referring to the region Holland, or the Netherlands? If the former, a link should be included, and if the latter, "Holland" should be changed to "the Netherlands" for all 3 instances - OpalYosutebito 『talk』『articles I want to eat』 15:42, 8 December 2025 (UTC)

The 1910, 1920 and 1930census uses Holland, but I am sure the mean to say Netherlands, specially since country was more commonly known as Holland up until 2020. I think is safe to replace it with Netherlands. Danifel (talk) 16:27, 8 December 2025 (UTC)

Done, I just cleaned it up. Danifel (talk) 00:02, 15 December 2025 (UTC)

@Danifel in citation 18, it cites the page number as R1. Is this a typo? - OpalYosutebito 『talk』『articles I want to eat』 02:54, 15 December 2025 (UTC)

Yes, it is a page in section R Danifel (talk) 14:37, 15 December 2025 (UTC)

Good to know! Also, what does this quote, and author who missed his plane and the critic who reviewed his latest book unfavorably. have to do with the apartment description? - OpalYosutebito 『talk』『articles I want to eat』 17:56, 18 December 2025 (UTC)

This is a quote describing the apartment in the building, copy paste from the architectural digest article. You can click on the link and read it :-) Danifel (talk) 03:57, 19 December 2025 (UTC)

Per WP:FAMILYSEARCH, "Family Search" is generally not very reliable, as it incorporates a large amount of user-generated content and rarely fact-checks. Also, I'm looking at 3 East 57th Street and 5 West 54th Street, alongside other GA-Class Architecture articles, for ideas on how the article can be written - OpalYosutebito 『talk』『articles I want to eat』 17:42, 10 March 2026 (UTC)

Another good source for inspiration can be https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Manhattan_House (GA) Danifel (talk) 18:53, 10 March 2026 (UTC)

I feel like sources 11 through 16 could be rearranged depending on chronological order. Instead of having them all clustered at the end of the paragraph, they should be evenly spread out (if possible) - OpalYosutebito 『talk』『articles I want to eat』 02:24, 22 April 2026 (UTC)

GA review

Unsuccessful. IAWW (talk) 09:33, 1 June 2026 (UTC)

The following discussion is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

This review is transcluded from Talk:444 East 58th Street/GA3. The edit link for this section can be used to add comments to the review.

Nominator: Danifel (talk · contribs) 02:57, 7 December 2025 (UTC)

Reviewer: It is a wonderful world (talk · contribs) 23:11, 25 May 2026 (UTC)

Hi @Danifel, I'll review this. I noticed you have been inactive for about a month, so could you indicate you'll be available to answer comments before I begin? IAWW (talk) 23:11, 25 May 2026 (UTC)

Failing due to no activity within a week, the typical timescale for GA reviews, and prolonged inactivity from the nominator. Feel free to renominate if you return and are available to see through a review. IAWW (talk) 09:33, 1 June 2026 (UTC)

The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

GA review

GA review

GA review

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