Talk:Air Mali (1960–1989)

I propose merging 1985 Air Mali Antonov An-24 crash into Air Mali (1960–1989) § Accidents and incidents. As deadly as this accident was, there simply isn't enough for this article to pass WP:GNG or WP:NEVENT. The majority of the coverage of the accident is either in contemporary sources or databases, none of which establish notability. I haven't been able to find any significant coverage in secondary sources post-1986 other than one line mentions such as these (which contain nothing of substance): From 2017: "Attaher Maïga est mort dans un accident d’avion à Tombouctou en 1985." [Attaher Maïga died in a plane crash in Timbuktu in 1985]; From 2022: "[Attaher Maïga] décède en 1985 dans un accident d’avion." [[Attaher Maïga] dies in a plane crash in 1985]. From this article in September of 1985, the only thing that seemed to have changed was the (temporary?) suspension of routes to Timbuktu, hardly a lasting effect. A merge to the aforementioned section would help expand the mention of the crash, which is pretty barebones. Aviationwikiflight (talk) 16:50, 19 August 2025 (UTC)

'''Oppose''' An important figure died in the crash and his name was Attaher Maïga. It's incredible there is any sustain coverage considering how there is no final report. There was also a sole survivor. There was a decent amount of coverage for a crash in Mali in 1985. I think it is notable. Zaptain United (talk) 20:49, 20 August 2025 (UTC)

"An important figure died in the crash and his name was Attaher Maïga." – If he was such an important figure, wouldn't there be more coverage other than one-line passing mentions that tell us absolutely nothing about the crash (other than the fact that he was killed in the crash)?

"It's incredible there is any sustain coverage considering how there is no final report." – It really isn't incredible considering that, as I've said above, the "sustained" coverage is just composed of one-line passing mentions that tell us nothing about the crash.

"There was also a sole survivor." – Doesn't establish notability.

"There was a decent amount of coverage for a crash in Mali in 1985." – Contemporary coverage does not establish notability, sustained continued coverage containing in-depth/significant coverage of the crash establishes notability, something which this accident simply does not have. If we were to say that notability is established through one-line passing mentions, then nearly every single aviation occurrence would be notable, something which is simply not true.

Next, let's look at WP:EVENTCRIT:

1. Events are probably notable if they have enduring historical significance and meet the general notability guideline, or if they have a significant lasting effect.
   1. N No enduring historical significance and does not meet WP:GNG as it requires secondary sources, none of which exist.
2. Events are also very likely to be notable if they have widespread (national or international) impact and were very widely covered in diverse sources, especially if also re-analyzed afterwards (as described below).
   1. N No widespread national or international impact. Although it was initially coverage in the initial aftermath of the accident, since 1986, there has been no significant coverage of the crash.
3. Events having lesser coverage or more limited scope may or may not be notable; the descriptions below provide guidance to assess the event.
   1. N No in-depth coverage.
   2. N No continued coverage with any "analysis or discussion".
   3. Y Received coverage in diverse sources, but that alone isn't enough to establish notability.
4. Routine kinds of news events (including most crimes, accidents, deaths, celebrity or political news, "shock" news, stories lacking lasting value such as "water cooler stories," and viral phenomena) – whether or not tragic or widely reported at the time – are usually not notable unless something further gives them additional enduring significance.
   1. N Soviet-era aircraft operated by an airline Mali, which at the time was a "corrupt and dictatorial regime". Plane crashes in Africa are routine (and will continue to be) as noted in this Deutsche Welle article.
   2. N Nothing gives this accident "additional enduring significance".

Aviationwikiflight (talk) 21:24, 20 August 2025 (UTC)

• Oppose Article meets the aspects mentioned of "generally accepted criteria for when to add mention of aircraft accidents" Wikipedia:WikiProject Aviation/Aircraft accidents and incidents. An incident with 51 people who died must have a lasting effect. It would be nice indeed to add offline sources from Mali. 95.98.65.177 (talk) 20:29, 26 August 2025 (UTC)

  The essay you are referring to also states that:

  By consensus this should not be used to determine whether a stand-alone article should exist or not. If an accident or incident meets the criteria for inclusion in an airport, airline or aircraft article it may also be notable enough for a stand-alone article, if it also meets the criteria provided by the general notability guideline, a notability of events guideline and a guide on the use of news reports.
  Because this is an essay and not policy and also because it should not be applied to stand-alone accident articles, it is recommended that it not be cited at Articles for Deletion discussions for either keeping or deleting.

  If you want, this accident meets all aspects of WP:AIRCRASH to be cited in an airport/airline/aircraft article, but WP:AIRCRASH is not for determining notability. "An incident with 51 people who died must have a lasting effect." – Feel free to find verifiable any evidence that would support your comment. Aviationwikiflight (talk) 04:36, 27 August 2025 (UTC)

  Is there a list we can add this to? Starlet147 (talk) 20:20, 11 October 2025 (UTC)

  Well I proposed Air Mali (1960–1989)#Accidents and incidents above. Aviationwikiflight (talk) 16:46, 19 October 2025 (UTC)

  Ok, thanks. Starry~~(Starlet147) 12:56, 23 October 2025 (UTC)

• Support merge, this is a simple news story and can be adequately covered at the target. Thebiguglyalien (talk) 🛸 02:01, 15 November 2025 (UTC)

So... this discussion have been rock since last month. Shaqil (talk) 21:42, 19 December 2025 (UTC)

The only reason this merge request hasn’t garnered more support is simply because of the large fatality count which included a politician. A plane crashed and it simply did not receive the necessary coverage or result in any lasting impact for it to be considered notable. Aviationwikiflight (talk) 07:38, 20 December 2025 (UTC)

I found this source:

https://archive.ph/TMGu6 Zaptain United (talk) 00:32, 21 December 2025 (UTC)

The article focuses on Attaher Maïga. The only mention of the plane crash is this one-line mention: "Attaher Maïga died at the age of 61 in a plane crash in the city of Timbuktu in 1985." Aviationwikiflight (talk) 11:48, 21 December 2025 (UTC)

• Oppose there's more than enough here for a stand-alone article that would be lost if merged. SportingFlyer T·C 20:19, 20 January 2026 (UTC)