Talk:Compost

This article was the subject of a Wiki Education Foundation-supported course assignment, between 5 February 2021 and 21 May 2021. Further details are available on the course page. Student editor(s): Nicholas1313Anderson, Figrainfall, EmmanuelFiagbe.

Above undated message substituted from Template:Dashboard.wikiedu.org assignment by PrimeBOT (talk) 19:24, 17 January 2022 (UTC)

This article is or was the subject of a Wiki Education Foundation-supported course assignment. Further details are available on the course page. Student editor(s): Maw057. Peer reviewers: Maw057.

Above undated message substituted from Template:Dashboard.wikiedu.org assignment by PrimeBOT (talk) 18:13, 16 January 2022 (UTC)

This section is too short. I am thinking of adding more well-sourced information about how different components of compost are able to contribute to pathogen removal. Figrainfall (talk) 12:26, 11 April 2021 (UTC) 0 We have added more words to the pathogen removal section. I think we need to read through and fish for passive language.(talk)

I have updated this page to align with the new Bokashi (horticulture) main article. Most of the old content is covered in the new and is relatively unimportant; some was just plain wrong; the single citation and the trademark "effective microorganisms" were commercials.

Having seen this in context I think that it should be moved from Compost#Other systems at a household level to Compost#Related technologies. Bokashi is also used above household level, and it is a different technology - using fermentation not decomposition - which puts it at odds with the definition at the start of Compost.

I also wonder whether it would be better to move the list of advantages into the main article, In favour, it might be thought heavy. Against, the comparison is notable knowledge for readers of the Compost page, who might not click across. Manofcarbon (talk) 20:01, 15 January 2019 (UTC) Malcolm

Support your good reasons to move Bokashi from Compost#Other systems at a household level to Compost#Related technologies and

Against moving the list of advantages of the Compost article to the main Bokashi article, it is good to have that comparative information on one page. -- Paleorthid (talk) 20:45, 15 January 2019 (UTC)

It is not the best place here to note this, but an opportunity, please: "the trademark "effective microorganisms" were commercials".
There are only two EXACT trademarks of this commercial product, (EM Effective Microorganisms, EFFECTIVE MICROORGANISMS); the exact correctly words and letters I can here remind not quite correct, please, sorry. And trademarks are just a mark as (in words and letters) REGISTERED.
(What I want to note to is: There is a commercial product, but it is a name - new - to what is already ever in the soil. Now can come a fight about, call it just organisms, microorganisms, ... NO. Sorry. Despite of there is a thing called Indigene Microorganisms also.)
This product (effective microorganisms) can be done homemade, with just some sorts of milk acidic bacteria. Because of less than the 80 sorts in the commercial product, now (from the trademark (?)) may not be called effective microorganisms ? It appears.
Just saying: effective microorganisms is not ONLY a commercial product. --Visionhelp (talk) 08:24, 7 August 2020 (UTC)

I removed this section which had been added to the very front of the article (not the right place) and also contained no references. If you want it back in please discuss here and also reconsider where in the article it fits best (probably under terminology):

"===Commercial composts=== In the British Isles - and possibly elsewhere - the term “compost” can also refer to potting mixes which are bagged up and sold commercially in garden centres and other outlets. This may include composted materials such as manure and peat, but is also likely to contain loam, fertilisers, sand, grit, etc. By far the most popular of these are the multi-purpose composts designed for most aspects of planting. There are also growbags, designed to have crops such as tomatoes directly planted into them. There is a range of specialist composts available, e.g. for vegetables, orchids, houseplants, hanging baskets, roses, ericaceous plants, seedlings, potting on etc. The term “compost” in this sense will also include the various products in the John Innes compost range." EMsmile (talk) 14:13, 11 September 2019 (UTC)

Re-added together with an RHS ref in a more appropriate place.  Velella  ^{Velella Talk}   14:43, 7 August 2020 (UTC)

Something could be said about how different kinds of composting produce different amounts of CO2 and methane and N2O. --Error (talk) 10:32, 30 April 2020 (UTC)

Is this worth a mention as technique? — Preceding unsigned comment added by Mlepisto (talk • contribs) 23:29, 11 May 2020 (UTC)

Please expand what you are trying to say? EMsmile (talk) 01:50, 26 May 2020 (UTC)

As I understand it, "direct composting" is a method where a person basically buries the items to be composted into the soil. The item then decomposes and provides nutrients at the point of use. Here's one (first google search result, no affiliation) that discusses it. I have used this method with some success, and noticed it was missing from this article. I'm wondering if it is worth a mention under technologies? https://www.veggiegardener.com/use-direct-composting-in-your-garden/ Mlepisto (talk) 02:17, 26 May 2020 (UTC)

I want to recommend this. Thanks.

Visionhelp (talk) 09:12, 9 September 2020 (UTC)

Up to date: Composting in place and Compost In-Situ it is called also.

* https://www.growveg.com/guides/composting-techniques-how-to-compost-in-situ/

* http://compostin.place/
(Sorry, this URL has gone. I would like at least a second source. Until found one I do let it stay just now, please.)

Let me just give this search support, please. I now cannot do the research. But one info: burying (kitchen-) wastes do break down within 4 weeks.

(https://www.ecosia.org/search?q=compost+in+place)

With permission, please: despite the main focus isn´t there on composting, because of the main there is the water household much bettering and therefrom the composting ´just´ a beside effect, but also just depending on the need (and in connection with which time of the year); Back to Eden Gardening Method, Ruth Stout´s method.

Visionhelp (talk) 10:07, 29 July 2021 (UTC)

More specifying and precise, but probably also very dis-placed, but after just being opened my mind to mulch and composting, coming from figuring out Direct composting, before from mulch no-work gardening (but this not in the main for compost, the focus here is water keeping more and longer in the soil, for less effort from watering and for saving the ressources of water), I am now recognizing the beside effect of them (Back To Eden Gardening Method, Ruth Stout´s method, and probably more) of as Direct composting, Composting in place, and also Mulch as an already water saving, work saving, and as a Direct composting and Composting in place method.

In yeartens some talks I never could may be known about this (to) Mulch, not which materials, not the water (the moisture) effects, and not even the composting effect really.
This probably may come from the use of Mulch as just in the difference of the thickness of the mulch layers. (Just an idea, please.)
So this is to the articles Compost and Mulch equaly.

Direct composting (at Youtube to find many videos) is used into healthy soil with being growing plants there, with fast degradable materials as also cooked food. (Breaks down within 4 weeks.)
Mulch, as used by Ruth Stout and in the Back To Eden Gardening Method (in the main wood chips here) is about 8 inches layer used
1.) for keeping water and moisture more and longer in the soil,
2.) to create, establish, a healthy, lividly soil on just clay (loam), with a layer of compost, but at least a layer manure (dung) plus a layer wood chips (keeps already more water in this soil and layers, but the focus here is creating a soil, which itself is a able to keep additionly more and longer water and moisture (creating possible within 2 months).

But AND both create compost, as Direct composting or Composting in place callable, multiply soil, despite ´only´ as side effect, they are ´WITH´: composting methods.
In hope, saying this (here) is OK. Thanks. Best Regards.
Visionhelp (talk) 13:13, 9 August 2021 (UTC)

Hi.
Pathogens are in organic - Eco - manure as well as in ´traditionel´ - chemical treated food, and what else - manure ? --Visionhelp (talk) 07:49, 7 August 2020 (UTC)

I have deleted that claim as it is unsupported by any citation (and unsupportable because it is totally open-ended). Some pathogens don't survive temperatures above 50°C but not all. Most of what survives will stay in the soil and never be taken up by plants. But not all. Most of what goes into kitchen compost or horse feed is free of pathogens, but not all. So the risk is tiny but we have no basis to claim that it doesn't exist (and won't find any reliable source that says otherwise). --John Maynard Friedman (talk) 12:04, 9 September 2020 (UTC)

Thanks, You did not remove - in a Talk page ! - it really. It is not a claim, it is a question, to recognize from the question mark. Visionhelp (talk) 13:00, 28 October 2020 (UTC)

" ´Not all Pathogens do go with temperatures above 50°C´ ": OK. (A saying against heat composting is secure. But: Because of ´life into soil´ I speak basically against heat composting.)
I took a view into that topic, https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pathogenicity.
Quote (from the german version of this article (translated with http://free-website-translation.com/?de)):
"Pathogenicity ( retronym suitcase word from the Greek πάθος pathos “suffering, disease” and γένεσις genesis “generation, birth”, cf. -genesis ) is the fundamental ability of infectious agents ( bacteria , parasites , viruses , prions , toxins ), diseases in certain organisms to evoke. [1] The adjective for this is pathogenic (pathogenic, potentially pathogenic), the opposite is non-pathogenic(not pathogenic). Pathogens also with the noun (the) pathogen called. The extent of the pathogenicity (ability of the pathogen to multiply and the intensity of the toxin formation) is referred to as virulence , without a uniform measure being defined for it. [2]".

This to me does say: this is a basic big and comprehensive topic. But not a never-ending.
It further does let me recognize, that in global nature already pathogenic is never to exclude, already without the all the addings from the human being.
With this info about this base I want to stop this point here for now.

To (quote) "Most of what survives will stay in the soil and never be taken up by plants": A need to this I cannot follow.
But alone to avoid poisons in plants I do prefer Eco.
Therefor this my question here, but sorry the double wording (manure) question.
Visionhelp (talk) 09:49, 17 November 2020 (UTC)

From the section titled, "Pathogen removal"...

Thermophilic (high-temperature) composting is well known to destroy many seeds and nearly all types of pathogens (exceptions may include prions). The sanitizing qualities of (thermophilic) composting are desirable where there is a high likelihood of pathogens, such as with manure.

From me...

The word "thermophilic" does not mean "high-temperature". The correct meaning is "heat-loving". For example, thermophilic bacteria are heat-loving bacteria. --Thibeinn (talk) 18:43, 24 August 2020 (UTC)

@Thibeinn: Yes, this is true. So go ahead and correct it! --John Maynard Friedman (talk) 08:53, 25 August 2020 (UTC)

Edmonton Composting Facility is no longer operating and will be demolished according to that page. So maybe it should be in past tense morsontologica (talk) 09:35, 13 October 2020 (UTC)

Hi User:Sadads some of the big changes that you made in October I disagree with. In particular: you have removed the entire section about composting toilets? Secondly, you have changed the part on animal waste and human waste a lot, to the extent of copying/excerpting the lead from reuse of excreta. This is what the "excerpt" method does, right? It always takes the entire lead from the other article? I don't think this makes sense here because composting is only one technology used for reuse of excreta. EMsmile (talk) 06:18, 28 October 2020 (UTC)

I've added now an excerpt for composting toilets. But does the excerpt always take the entire lead? Is it possible to only take the first paragraph of the lead? The entire lead might be too much information. EMsmile (talk) 06:24, 28 October 2020 (UTC)

I've figured out how to limit the number of paragraphs of the lead that are to be included in the excerpt. That's good. EMsmile (talk) 08:32, 28 October 2020 (UTC)

I've reinstated the earlier sections on animal manure and bedding, and human excreta and sewage sludge. The excerpting with "reuse of excreta" didn't work well in this case.EMsmile (talk) 08:39, 28 October 2020 (UTC)

@EMsmile: Thats fine -- I was just trying to remove the wildly inconsistent and bad content in the article -- you are totally an expert in the space, so there is probably a lot we could do to push it towards a more thorough and complete article. Sadads (talk) 12:26, 30 October 2020 (UTC)