Talk:The Celestial Toymaker

I'm not entirely sure the character page needs to be seperate. There's little in there that is necessary outside of the story's page. However, as I type this, it occurs to me that there might be a concurrent series of pages just for the characters, in which case it would be valid, and my merge request is not.

Anyone?

There is such a series, so I'm removing the request.

Hi, the article says, there are 1023 pieces in the trilogic game, which basically is the "tower of Hanoi", as I saw in the remaining part on DVD. I think, there are only 8 pieces but 1023 movements. (I'm not sure, however, if "piece" may be a synonym for movement. in this case, it is right.) --Hutschi 12:24, 8 January 2007 (UTC)

Having just watched it, Hutschi is correct. There are 1023 moves, not 1023 pieces. However, it's a 10 piece "tower of Hanoi" type game, not 8. Additionally, rather than being a vast three dimensional puzzle as described in the page, it's a regular table top game measuring perhaps a foot to a side when completed. Xiphiphile 01:20, 20 May 2007 (UTC)

It's not possible for Richards' estate to complain about the similarity of Bunter and Cyril in 1963, with the story not being written let alone broadcast for three years! I'd assume it was in 1966, with the BBC adding a disclaimer on episode four. Not to speculate though, so out the date comes!MartinSFSA (talk) 08:28, 7 April 2008 (UTC)

In acknowledging that the "nigger" word has been overdubbed or de-emphasised in the audio release, the text implies that it was acceptable in 1966, by implication saying that is was near-universally acceptable. In certain circles, it obviously must have been, or the script would not have reached production. But I think it is not fair to suggest that the word was acceptable in Britain universally in the sixties. My parents (I was born in 63) certainly viewed it as offensive and they were not especially liberal. I was instructed to use "catch a rotter". Obviously, personal experiences will vary. For comparison, a reference to this word in Gilbert And Sullivan's "The Mikado" was amended some twenty years before. I would suggest this be amended to say that the word was "considered inoffensive in many circles" - I do not wish to erase the historical reality, but to reflect it better. Rob Burbidge (talk) 13:08, 12 July 2019 (UTC)

Please cite a reliable source saying any of the above. DonQuixote (talk) 13:19, 12 July 2019 (UTC)

The consensus appears to have been that in the absence of any verifiable source supporting one interpretation or the other - to instead remove any mention this (albeit probably inconsequential) point. The original mention of this can be found in Note 5 of edit 56142015. Jimw338 (talk) 03:25, 12 March 2021 (UTC)

In case my most recent edit is challenged, I would like to point out that Wikipedia is not censored so would therefore feature content that some readers may find offensive. Therefore I would like to suggest leaving the racial slur uncensored as I feel it is necessary to the interpretation of the article particularly for readers who may not already know what the "N word" is e.g. second language speakers.

Also, I would like to debate on how to present the handling of this issue in the animated reconstruction. About 11 minutes into episode 2 (The Hall of Dolls) the King can be heard singing "Eeny meany miny moe" after the Queen suggested they pick a chair at random. However, the offending word appears to have been replaced with indecipherable muttering and is not mentioned in the subtitles on BBC iPlayer.Tk420 (talk) 20:21, 7 April 2026 (UTC)

The article previously used the phrasing a racial slur to match the sources (who mostly just use the N-word), which is appropriate per WP:BOWDLERIZE—though this change seems fine too. I don't think there's any real reason to specifically mention how the animation handles it, unless sources deem it important; it seems to be covered by obscured or removed already. – Rhain ☔ (he/him) 22:35, 7 April 2026 (UTC)

The Toymaker character made his first canon appearance in the 3rd 2023 (Holiday?) special. Given that a number of non-canon appearances in Big Finish and other non-canon Doctor Who media.

Seems worthy of a mention, and/or a link to said special's Wikipedia entry. 172.101.144.112 (talk) 06:08, 31 December 2023 (UTC)

From the article: The Toymaker, played by Neil Patrick Harris, appeared as the antagonist in "The Giggle", the third and final of the 60th anniversary specials released in 2023. DonQuixote (talk) 07:51, 31 December 2023 (UTC)

Rehearsals for the serial started on 21 March, and weekly recording began on 18 March in Studio 1 of Riverside Studios. Hey Rhain is this correct? Or is it supposed to be 12 March? Seems odd to have rehearsals take place after recording... – zmbro _{(talk) (cont)} 19:28, 18 February 2026 (UTC)

Good catch! The reference actually says the same thing, but you're right, this doesn't make sense; rehearsals always ran from Monday to Thursday, followed by filming on Friday. I've corrected the date and added a ref to support it. – Rhain ☔ (he/him) 20:52, 18 February 2026 (UTC)

According to

• Howe, David J.; Stammers, Mark; Walker, Stephen James (1994). Doctor Who The Handbook - The First Doctor. London: Doctor Who Books. pp. 308–311. ISBN 0-426-20430-1.

Monday 14 March was when four days preliminary rehearsal began. Each episode was "camera rehearsed and recorded in Riverside 1" on Fridays from 18 March to 8 April. --Redrose64 🌹 (talk) 21:10, 18 February 2026 (UTC)

Thanks. This was the same information stated by Brunt 2024, so I just used that; Wright 2018 still has the correct filming dates. – Rhain ☔ (he/him) 21:16, 18 February 2026 (UTC)

Weekly four-day rehearsals - there's no indication in Howe et al that this was a weekly event; just 14-17 March. Each individual episode was reherased on the same day that it was recorded. Looking through the chapter, we find a similar situation for other stories: for example, The Gunfighters had four days of preliminary rehearsal beginning Monday 11 April, with the individual episodes being both rehearsed and recorded on successive Fridays from 15 April to 6 May. --Redrose64 🌹 (talk) 21:45, 18 February 2026 (UTC)

It was always a weekly event: for every episode, they rehearsed for four days, then recorded for one (see Monday 14 on p. 222). I've expanded the ref to verify. – Rhain ☔ (he/him) 22:24, 18 February 2026 (UTC)