Talk:Vicinity Centres

Under Centro Properties Group#Current operations I notice the following example of several similar citations:

Centro currently has interests in total assets claimed to be worth USD$22.6 billion ^[1] (at June 2008) representing approximately 810 shopping centres in three countries – Australia, New Zealand and the United States - with over 106 million square feet of retail space in the United States alone.^[2]

I question whether this type of citation is acceptable because it refers only to a website which can be changed from day to day—thus relying on the initiating editor's honesty and/or the reader's credulity. Unencyclopedic, I would suggest! The second web citation has in fact already changed from "106 million" to "104 million" as at today's date. (NB: I have tidied up the codes a bit to make the issues clearer.) Bjenks (talk) 03:50, 7 January 2009 (UTC)

Agreed. A bigger question is whether we should be using primary sources for such information. Orderinchaos 06:50, 7 January 2009 (UTC)

Yes, I would accept ASX statements, audited annual reports, reputable journals, etc, but not transitory self-statements of the type which appear on commercial websites. Bjenks (talk) 09:59, 7 January 2009 (UTC)

I've tried updating some of the article but feel it might need a major re-write. (Ansett (talk) 11:33, 26 April 2012 (UTC)

You're right. This is a huge mess! I'll give it some thought, but it's not high on my priorities. Cheers. Rangasyd (talk) 11:55, 27 April 2012 (UTC)

Hi (Rangasyd) and (Ansett) I'm re-writing this article, it's a mess, outdated and wrong. Company has changed big time and now is even going trough a major restructure. (OzzyMaker).

Did the history section come from its refinancing pitch? It completely brushes over the financial difficulties the company faced that led to the restructuring and eventual rebranding. --62.189.73.197 (talk) 10:05, 24 December 2013 (UTC)

Odd indeed. Two paragraphs had been there about it until 23 December, when a single edit removed them. I've restored them, as they were fully referenced. Someone else with more knowledge of the area may need to look at it to make sure it integrates. Orderinchaos 01:41, 26 December 2013 (UTC)

Hi guys, I'm the editor who made the changes. I don't see anything odd and if you allow me to substantiate my changes you will see there's a reason for each one.

Re: Section Financial performance, sentence “The terms of the three-year plan may involve some restructure and asset sales.” – This is speculative and without substantiation. Therefore originally it has been deleted due to conjecture and now I'm deleting again.

Re: Section Financial performance, sentence starting with “In December 2007”, ending “loans due to expire on 15 February 2008.” – The information already exists in the page therefore it has not been deleted fully. This information is repetitive and exists in the History section in the paragraph starting with “Between 2003 and 2007, Centro and its managed funds”. Therefore it now exists more appropriately in the History section (besides the fact that the following 2nd sentence has a dead link)

Re: Section Financial performance, sentence starting with “In January 2009, they reached”, ending “$3.9 billion syndicated debt facility.” – The information already exists in the page therefore it has not been deleted fully. This information is repetitive and exists in the History section in the paragraph and following dot points starting with “On 16 January 2009, Centro announced”. Therefore it now exists more appropriately in the History section.

Regarding the "Financial performance" portion starting with “It was speculated that the American-based”, ending “refinance loans of $4.5 billion in December 2008” I propose additional changes. With the removal of its opening and closing paragraphs that already more appropriately exists in the History section, so as to provide greater context, this section should be transferred to its relevant chronological place in History. As this section should be current my suggestion for final copy in this section should be:

"The Group has now removed the legacy issues relating to the assets former ownership structure under Centro Properties Group (see History). Federation Centres retains a positive financial position with balance sheet gearing as at July 2013 of 18.3%.[23] As of the Australian financial year of 2013, Federation Centres has posted a statutory full year profit of $212.7 million (24).

(23 - Source - Australian Securities Exchange (http://www.asx.com.au/asxpdf/20130819/pdf/42hr0fkz3vyzr7.pdf)

(24 - Source - News.com.au (http://www.news.com.au/finance/business/stocks-to-watch-on-monday/story-e6frfkur-1226699624995)

Ozzymaker (talk) 01:28, 9 January 2014 (UTC)

The entire article basically needs to be started again... it currently reads like a corporate press release. Please note that if you have a conflict of interest, we have a policy on this at WP:COI. Orderinchaos 02:06, 9 January 2014 (UTC)

I might disagree that currently reads like a corporate press release, but then again this is just my opinion. I think in fact the changes have been documented with clear evidence and considering my journalism background I would say it's factual, however I wouldn't like to ignite a debate as we both agree that the entire article needs to be re-written. Would you like to take the lead? Ozzymaker (talk) 03:44, 9 January 2014 (UTC)

Hello fellow Wikipedians,

I have just added archive links to one external link on Vicinity Centres. Please take a moment to review my edit. If necessary, add {{cbignore}} after the link to keep me from modifying it. Alternatively, you can add {{nobots|deny=InternetArchiveBot}} to keep me off the page altogether. I made the following changes:

• Added archive https://web.archive.org/20071217194557/http://www.theaustralian.news.com.au:80/story/0,25197,22937029-643,00.html to http://www.theaustralian.news.com.au/story/0,25197,22937029-643,00.html

When you have finished reviewing my changes, please set the checked parameter below to true to let others know.

This message was posted before February 2018. After February 2018, "External links modified" talk page sections are no longer generated or monitored by InternetArchiveBot. No special action is required regarding these talk page notices, other than regular verification using the archive tool instructions below. Editors have permission to delete these "External links modified" talk page sections if they want to de-clutter talk pages, but see the RfC before doing mass systematic removals. This message is updated dynamically through the template {{source check}} (last update: 5 June 2024).

• If you have discovered URLs which were erroneously considered dead by the bot, you can report them with this tool.
• If you found an error with any archives or the URLs themselves, you can fix them with this tool.

Cheers.—^{cyberbot II}_{Talk to my owner:Online} 04:26, 15 January 2016 (UTC)

The comment(s) below were originally left at Talk:Vicinity Centres/CommentsTalk:Vicinity Centres/Comments, and are posted here for posterity. Following several discussions in past years, these subpages are now deprecated. The comments may be irrelevant or outdated; if so, please feel free to remove this section.

Substituted at 22:03, 26 June 2016 (UTC)