Talk:Metroidvania

The definition of a Metroidvania has definitely evolved. Many communities no longer consider the side-scrolling, 2D definition to be a hard requirement. Most gaming platforms and media reviews are happy to consider 3D games as Metroidvanias, and have been doing so for over a decade (e.g. Metroid Prime, Arkham Asylum, Prey).

Strong definition points:

• Interconnected world: This emphasizes open exploration from any region to another on a single map (as opposed to a connected-hub or a dungeon-based world design)
• Power-ups: Most Metroidvanias feature collecting power-ups and abilities (usually obtained after a boss fight) that both strengthen the player and unlock access to new regions
• Utility/Ability-gated progression: Access to new areas is provided via acquired power-ups
• Backtracking: Players are encouraged to visit previously-explored regions after unlocking access to sub-regions
• Non-linear progression: Players are usually not forced to explore regions in a specific order

Traditional definition points:

• Side-scrolling
• 2D or 2.5D
• Platforming: Most Metroidvania games include areas with difficult platforming sequences

I recommending updating the page to reflect the evolution in definition. --HSukePup (talk) 19:41, 5 February 2020 (UTC)

Do we have a source for that? I don't disagree it has been expanded beyond 2D, but I've not seen a source that gives such rules for a modern metroidvania. --Masem (t) 20:33, 5 February 2020 (UTC)

--

There are multiple news sources that already assume that 3D games can fit the definition.^[1][2][3][4]

However, it is somewhat of a chicken-and-egg problem. Until we define it here, most news media are reluctant to make it so. I've been following the Metroidvania subreddit for years. In recent years, the vast majority no longer consider 2D or side-scrolling an important definition for the genre. Platforming still seems to be quite important though.^{[5] [6] [7] [8]}. The main thing preventing most 3D Metroidvania-like games from being true Metroidvanias is not the 3D aspect, but the hardware memory limitations that prevent 3D games from having an interconnected world (e.g. divided sections + loading screens).

The community has already indicated strong interest in including 3D games. At the very least, I recommend mentioning that the definition is either evolving, or that 2D & sidescrolling are loose or disputed definitions. --HSukePup (talk) 16:58, 6 February 2020 (UTC)

Keep in mind we can't use reddit at all as a source (outside verified AMAs or RSes repeating details). --Masem (t) 17:02, 6 February 2020 (UTC)

That said, you do have the issue right: WP can't set a definition is not defined elsewhere. A comparable case is made in roguelikes as there is the Berlin Interpretation, well documented, that we can use to show how "roguelike-likes" tend to differ. We don't have anything like that here, and that's possibly because the genre doesn't have the large number of games that roguelikes have. We almost sorta need that type of coming together on an agreement of a definition by users that is then covered by reliable sources to establish the difference. I do think our article does try to say that Metroidvanias are mostly side-scrolling platformers (necessarily 2/2.5D) with some 3D games touching on the principles. But right now without a singular definition like the Berlin Interpretation we can't set out hard rules.

I also did a quick scan of academic resources, as there's interest in AI-assisted procedural generation of Metroidvania maps, and there the "defintion" of what a Metroidvania is becomes a bit more important, though I've haven't found a good one that we can use. But it did point me to this video from the old 1up where Jeremy Parish, Scott Sharkley, and Chris Kolher discuss the key aspects of the genre which we reasonable can include. --Masem (t) 17:43, 6 February 2020 (UTC)

Instead of reverting all my changes, could you make surgical edits instead? Parts of this article are outdated and no longer reflect common knowledge. It's perpetuating the chicken and egg problem discussed earlier. What would it take for you to budge? An article from Polycom, IGN, Kotaku, etc? Sometimes they make questionable calls like referring to "The Messenger" as an MV. I'm done. You can continue gate-keeping this article. --HSukePup (talk) 19:53, 27 May 2020 (UTC)

If you're talking about newer aspects of Metrovanais, that would be additional text, not changes to the existing stuff. The old definitions of Metroidvanias haven't changed and those games still exist but certainly there could be new concepts that indie games and other titles have added, just as they have with roguelikes. That said, I've not seen good singular articles that point those out in depth and in broad terms of the genre. --Masem (t) 19:56, 27 May 2020 (UTC)

Too bad, this subgenre is defined by two primary games that use these features. If I could coin the subgenre, it'd be something like: Interconnected 2D Platform. Pretty much, the characteristics are noted. KyuuA4 (Talk:キュウ) 10:18, 11 December 2020 (UTC)

I believe 'Zorro' for 8 bit computers (1984) fit the description. No large worlds due to limitations of the devices where it run, yet is a world made up of a series of rooms that require solving puzzles and revisiting previous ones to reach new screens, and mixes puzzle solving with platform arcade. Actually many games from 8 bit era may be seen as pre-metroidvanias because of their mechanics of collecting items through a series of screens (check 'Cauldron')

To the IP that is trying to include the USENET post:

1. USENET posts are user-generated content and thus not reliable, we can't use them.
2. On the basis of the claim that it may be the first documented use of "metroidvania", that's original research since its impossible from that alone to prove it is the first use of the term anywhere. We rely on secondary sources to provide us origins or first-uses as best they can research since we cannot do that research ourselves.
3. Where you are changing this is not where it is relevant. Let's assume that "metroidvania" first was used after Circle of the Moon came out, for all purposes. That doesn't change the fact that in its genre's current form today, SotH is considered the first key Castlevania game that has all the defining traits of the Metroidvania genre, even though the term "Metroidvania" would not be used for some years after the game was released. This article is not making the claim that the term "Metroidvania" derived specifically from the game SotH, so it doesn't matter if it came from Circle of the Moon or not; the term is a portmanteau of the series names Metroid and Castlevania, not of any specific name. Thus, while Circle of the Moon may be blessed to be the first game to be specifically called a Metroidvania doesn't make it the first Metroidvania. --Masem (t) 14:38, 19 February 2021 (UTC)

That term surely needs a source. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 115.70.22.139 (talk) 11:12, 2 October 2021 (UTC)

Yes it does; I've taken it out as I can't confirm anything via Google for it. --Masem (t) 12:35, 2 October 2021 (UTC)

Never heard of 'Castleroid' in my long gaming life, either. If you have castleroids, see your doctor. LkeYHOBSTorItEwA (talk) 05:43, 13 May 2023 (UTC)

The redirect Soulsvania has been listed at redirects for discussion to determine whether its use and function meets the redirect guidelines. Readers of this page are welcome to comment on this redirect at Wikipedia:Redirects for discussion/Log/2024 March 24 § Soulsvania until a consensus is reached. Utopes _{(talk / cont)} 20:36, 24 March 2024 (UTC)

The primary addition to the action-adventure genre from Metroid was the gaining of new abilities to progress in a non-linear side-view environment. In watering down this definition over time the term "Metroidvania" is now structurally identical to the term "Action-Adventure game" and as such is no longer necessary.

Without the side-view or platformer stipulation, the original Zelda is a Metroidvania, and without the permanent power-ups stipulation, any action game that used keys are also now Metroidvania's, even non-linear action games which gated areas until the player had certain specific items were common place in the years leading up to Metroid, such as with games like Pyjamarama in 1984. Watering down both stipulations means that Resident Evil is also a Metroidvania, along with almost the entire classic survival horror genre. This term is now meaningless. 2A00:23CC:B481:6801:B4D2:2FF7:D8DA:DD2F (talk) 13:26, 1 April 2024 (UTC)

Do you have any reliable sources to justify those claims? Masem (t) 13:47, 1 April 2024 (UTC)

You're mostly right. Gamers have a desire to put similar features of games they love in one pot. Recursive-backtracking, secret finding, exploiting new knowledge and abilities, are getting lumped together in the same genre even when they are more accurately fitted into other genres like Soulslikes, Adventure (Click) games, Zelda-likes, JRPGs, etc. LkeYHOBSTorItEwA (talk) 02:13, 27 September 2025 (UTC)

Could we have more image variety? The two game images featured are both from Guacamelee! — there's more in-game screenshots of that game on this page than on its own. For such a large genre it feels there should be more games pictured than just Guacamelee!. —𝚃𝚠𝚒𝚗𝙱𝚘𝚘 (talk) 21:36, 29 October 2025 (UTC)

We have those as freely licensed images so any further images would also need to be freely licensed. Masem (t) 21:53, 29 October 2025 (UTC)

Likely to avoid a circular definition and using a term that Nintendo themselves would not use about Metroid, all Metroid games' articles on Wikipedia simply list them as "action-adventure" games, even though this is misleading and slightly ironic considering non-Metroid, Metroid-like games are still called metroidvanias. There has been discussion on here about the viability of the "search-action game" moniker in regards to all metroidvanias, but even if editors cannot agree on this specific term being relevant enough, there should probably be some kind of solution or compromise between incorrectly calling all Metroid games simply "action-adventures" or explaining metroidvanias in a roundabout way in every single article. FranccaYT (talk) 01:22, 25 November 2025 (UTC)

Its not clear if older games like the OG metroid have been called such. Given that the formula that most MVs is based on C:SOTN, earlier games can probably best be described as having the forming elements of an MV but are not MVs in of themselves. Certainly if we do have sources that routinely call older games as MVs, we can use that term (like as it is on C:SOTN). Masem (t) 02:06, 25 November 2025 (UTC)

Wikipedia follows the sources. And categories should follow the prose, which follows the sources. If sources call it a metroidvania, it's a metroidvania. If they don't, it's not. I realize this creates some cognitive friction for older games, but the term was invented later. As Masem said, some sources have addressed this for games that predate the category: Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles III: Radical Rescue is a useful example. Shooterwalker (talk) 16:41, 17 December 2025 (UTC)