User talk:Shwabb1

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Happy editing! I dream of horses ^{(Contribs) (Talk)} 15:57, 23 June 2023 (UTC)

This is a standard message to notify contributors about an administrative ruling in effect. It does not imply that there are any issues with your contributions to date. You have shown interest in Russo-Ukrainian war. Due to past disruption in this topic area, the community has authorised uninvolved administrators to impose contentious topics restrictions—such as editing restrictions, bans, or blocks—on editors who do not strictly follow Wikipedia's policies, expected standards of behaviour, or the page-specific restrictions, when making edits related to the topic. For additional information, please see the guidance on these sanctions. If you have any questions, or any doubts regarding what edits are appropriate, you are welcome to discuss them with me or any other editor.

Hi Shwabb1. Thank you for your creation of the redirects to the Crimean Tatar names of places in Crimea. This message I put above is just to let you know that wikipedia has some specific rules related to the Russo-Ukranian war that are not in place on other pages. The most notable of these is that generally one needs to be an extended confirmed user to work in this space. You didn't do anything that has caused issues in that I have patrolled your redirects; however, I would advise against making more of them until you have hit extended confirmed user status. Sorry to be a bit of the bearer of bad news, but please keep up the good work and once you hit that extended-confirmed status, feel free to start making these redirects again because they are helpful. Best! TartarTorte 13:24, 2 October 2023 (UTC)

Alright, thanks for letting me know. But I have to note that these are not just names in another language - they are officially used by the Ukrainian authorities since 23 August 2023 instead of the Soviet names. Shwabb1 (talk) 15:26, 2 October 2023 (UTC)

Most certainly! I have no opposition to the creation of these redirects as a concept and once you hit ECU, I'd more than encourage you to continue creating these redirects as they are helpful. I was just noting that per WP:GS/RUSUKR, it seems that you cannot continue to create these redirects until you hit 500 edits. Have a great rest of your day! TartarTorte 17:23, 2 October 2023 (UTC)

Hello, Shwabb1. Thank you for your work on Ozera, Bucha Raion, Kyiv Oblast. User:ARandomName123, while examining this page as a part of our page curation process, had the following comments:

Thanks for your work on this page!

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ARandomName123 (talk)^{Ping me!} 14:49, 18 October 2023 (UTC)

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Hello! You wrote that not all current hromadas with their administrative seat in a rural settlement are settlement hromadas. But when I look into uk:Список_територіальних_громад_України I see otherwise that all current hromadas with their administrative seat in a rural settlement are settlement hromadas. Do you know any hromada with its administrative seat in a rural settlement which is rural hromada? Aldij (talk) 10:59, 15 May 2024 (UTC)

Hello. The list is incorrect. AHBot automatically moved every hromada with its center in a rural settlement to settlement hromada in Ukrainian Wikipedia, but that is not the case in real life. This has already been discussed at Talk:Urban-type settlements in Ukraine. The name of a hromada is based on the name of the local council (law) rather than the status of the settlement. One example that was pointed out is Kamianyi Mist rural hromada (as indicated on their official website).

Before the abolishment of urban-type settlements, there were two types of rural populated places (villages and rural settlements), and the councils of either would be called village councils (and the corresponding hromadas therefore were rural). Meanwhile, the councils of urban-type settlements were called settlement councils (and the corresponding hromadas were settlement). When urban-type settlements were abolished, their status merged with rural settlements - but the councils of pre-2024 rural settlements remained as village councils, while the councils of the "new" rural settlements remained as settlement councils. Shwabb1 (talk) 11:31, 15 May 2024 (UTC)

Hm, it is more complicated that I thought. Maybe you are right. Thank you for the detailed answer! Aldij (talk) 11:52, 15 May 2024 (UTC)

You were right about former rural settlements, they are now gradually becoming villages, see and . Aldij (talk) 12:15, 6 June 2024 (UTC)

That's interesting, I think this is a good solution to this confusing mess. Shwabb1 (talk) 12:34, 6 June 2024 (UTC)

This category is for settlements founded by Varangian Rus, not settlements first mentioned hundreds of years later, or settlements founded by Khazars, Slavs, etc. Mellk (talk) 05:14, 6 June 2024 (UTC)

Why? There's no description. The linked categories on Russian and Ukrainian Wikipedias are different: the former shows former cities that existed on the territory of Rus' but do not exist anymore, while the latter shows all cities that existed on the territory of Rus'. I decided to interpret the English category the same as the Ukrainian category as the Russian one explicitly mentions the word "former" in the name. Shwabb1 (talk) 10:10, 6 June 2024 (UTC)

It is a subcategory of Category:History of the Rus' people. Rus people were Varangians originally. "Rus" when referring to a region also has many different definitions, so I do not think it is a good idea to categorize it this way. Mellk (talk) 10:47, 6 June 2024 (UTC)

It is true that the word Rus' originally referred to some Varangians, but later the name was adopted as an ethnonym for people of the Kievan Rus' as the "original" Rus' people got assimilated, so the name is still somewhat vague. To avoid confusion, should there be a separate category for cities of Kievan Rus' then? Shwabb1 (talk) 11:10, 6 June 2024 (UTC)

I do not think we have any categories for cities in former countries. This category is more to do with archaeological sites, so it falls under Category:Archaeological sites in Ukraine etc which falls under Category:Archaeological sites in Europe by country. Mellk (talk) 11:19, 6 June 2024 (UTC)

OK, thank you for clarification. Shwabb1 (talk) 11:34, 6 June 2024 (UTC)

Sure, no problem. Sorry if I was not very clear at first. Mellk (talk) 11:38, 6 June 2024 (UTC)

I have added a hatnote to make this a bit clearer. Mellk (talk) 10:54, 6 June 2024 (UTC)

An automated process has detected that when you recently edited Pomoriany, you added a link pointing to the disambiguation page Zolochiv Raion.

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Many thanks for your work with the WHS lists. Whenever new sites are added, this means lots of updates :) Don't forget to move the Nelson Mandela sites to the main list from South Africa, I think you skipped it ;) Tone 16:05, 1 August 2024 (UTC)

You are right, I'll add them in a moment. Shwabb1 ⟨taco⟩ 16:06, 1 August 2024 (UTC)

Hi Shwabb1. Thank you for your work on Holy Transfiguration Monastery (Horodok, Ukraine). Another editor, Kingsmasher678, has reviewed it as part of new pages patrol and left the following comment:

Thanks!

To reply, leave a comment here and begin it with {{Re|Kingsmasher678}}. (Message delivered via the Page Curation tool, on behalf of the reviewer.)

Kingsmasher678 (talk) 13:20, 20 September 2024 (UTC)

Hey Shwabb1, hope you're doing well! :) Thought I'd reach out and ask since you're really good with Ukrainian transliterations: I just finished adding in all the inter-wiki language links into List of villages in Donetsk Oblast and was hoping you could check through them to see if there's any mispellings/other transliteration mistakes. Hoping to turn this into an FL eventually and also to use it create the articles for all the villages (like I did for Bakhmut Raion sometime ago). No worries if you're too busy but it would be much appreciated. Many thanks for everything (and for updating the cities lists with the new names)! :D Dan the Animator 02:56, 25 September 2024 (UTC)

Hi. Sure, I can do that. Shwabb1 ⟨taco⟩ 09:21, 25 September 2024 (UTC)

Ok, I think I'm all done now. Fixed misspellings, added hromadas to help disambiguate some villages, and applied the recent renamings. Shwabb1 ⟨taco⟩ 11:19, 27 September 2024 (UTC)

Great work, it looks perfect! Thanks Shwabb1!! :) I'll be working on moving the villages into a table and expanding the lead and I'm thinking if it's alright with you, I might ask for some opinions about the article here and there. Also, while I probably won't be completely ready with it for a bit, I made some progress into compiling the lists of villages for the rest of the country and will hopefully have them ready to look over sooner than later. I left my work-in-progress as a hidden comment mostly in one of my userpages (due to Wikipedia byte limits, I had to put the villages of the last six oblasts in a second userpage) so feel free to check in case you're curious. Also, saw your edits to the derussification name changes list and wanted to say thanks! Thought I'd suggest it but I'd also be interested in bringing that list to FL status if you want to work on it together. Let me know what you're thinking and thanks again for the help! Dyakuyu! :) Dan the Animator 06:16, 29 September 2024 (UTC)

Yeah it's fine, you can ask me anything. Thanks for mentioning the derussification name changes list, it still needs a lot of work (not only the lead, also fixing all the links). I'm not really familiar with all the requirements for getting FL status so it would be great if you could help with the page whenever you have time (though no need to rush because not all of the planned renamings have happened yet, including Pavlohrad, Synelnykove, Pervomaisk, Khrustalnyi, Yuzhne, Yuzhnoukrainsk, Brovary, many many villages...) Shwabb1 ⟨taco⟩ 12:48, 29 September 2024 (UTC)

Thanks and sounds good! :) Dan the Animator 15:03, 29 September 2024 (UTC)

Selyshche is a new official category of Ukrainian populated places, so it is unhelpful to bundle it into undifferentiated class "Rural settlement". --Altenmann >talk 07:13, 5 May 2025 (UTC)

Hello. I think there's some confusion, as selyshche is not a new category. Before 2024, it had referred to what the English Wikipedia translated as "rural-type settlement," to contrast with selyshche miskoho typu, which was translated as "urban-type settlement." Since 2024, the two were merged into the existing category of selyshche, which is now translated as "rural settlement" per WP:UAPLACE. Also see any other page of a rural settlement, for example Hostomel, Medzhybizh, Sarata, or anything in Category:Rural settlements by raions in Ukraine -- all pages and categories use the term "rural settlement" and link to Populated places in Ukraine#Rural settlements. I don't see why Korop specifically shouldn't follow the same pattern. I also don't understand why "rural settlement" in undifferentiated, as it's used specifically to refer to selyshche in this case, and if you believe that it shouldn't be translated, the same case could be made for city/misto and village/selo because, technically speaking, those terms do not necessarily correspond with the common English definitions. All things considered, I think it's better to keep using the term "rural settlement," unless you have a case for editing all those pages and moving all categories, which I think is just unnecessary work that would only make things more confusing. I hope this clears everything up. Shwabb1 ⟨taco⟩ 14:16, 5 May 2025 (UTC)

The English term is ambiguous. RUral settlement means settlement in rural area. It may be even khutor. Regarding 'selo' and 'misto', the English translations are long established and there is no ambiguity. --Altenmann >talk 15:18, 5 May 2025 (UTC)

Regarding Category:Rural settlements by raions in Ukraine, it was created long time ago, but new terminology was introduced only in 2024 during "decommunization", and pages there contain both selyshches (Pryazovske population 6295) and villages (Kyrylivka pop. 1805), and this must be cleaned up, but nobody cares I guess. And that nobody cares is not the reason to revert to wrong terminlogy after it was modified to address the change in the law. --Altenmann >talk 15:18, 5 May 2025 (UTC)

P.S. a similar situation is in Lithuania, where since recent times officially there are two types of cities: miestas (literally "town") and miestelis (literally "small town"), and often the English don't care how to translate. Fortunately, the usually the place is officially designated miestas/miestelis, and even the population count changes, the type does not necessarily automatically changes. --Altenmann >talk 15:24, 5 May 2025 (UTC)

Well, is there a better translation that's not "rural settlement"? Etymologically, selyshche is an augmentative of selo, and that can't be expressed exactly in English. The Ukrainian government tends to translate this as "settlement" which is even more ambiguous (and yet an argument can be made that that's the "official" name). Keeping the Ukrainian term is inconsistent with translating misto and selo. It seems Ykvach was the person to push the use of the specific term "rural settlement". Do you think a larger discussion at a talk page for Populated places should be opened to get more opinions on this? Then whenever the consensus is reached, it can be included in WP:UAPLACE.

Also, both Pryazovske and Kyrylivka are rural settlements/selyshcha, I'm not sure what you mean there. And khutirs were never re-established in Ukraine (unlike Russia), they remain as villages officially, totaling to only 3 types of populated places. There's also the term silskyi naselenyi punkt (translated as "rural populated place" currently in the Populated places article), and that's what covers both selo and selyshche categories. Shwabb1 ⟨taco⟩ 15:41, 5 May 2025 (UTC)

Kyrylivka: its population is 3,416, which is less than the threshold of 5,000. hence it is not selyshche. Whoever edited the page, cited the russian-language source and of course, screwed up ("Chinese whispers"). --Altenmann >talk 16:36, 5 May 2025 (UTC)

I see, you must be talking about law 3285-IX, which was often misinterpreted by the news. All it does is introduce specific guidelines to change the status of populated places based on population and population density, but it does not automatically change the status. See Article 8, it delineates the process of up/downgrading in status (by Verkhovna Rada to become a misto, by local government and/or Cabinet of Ministers to become a selyshche/selo). So, Kyrylivka is eligible to become a selo, but only if the process is initiated by the local government. However, that has not happened; thus, it remains a selyshche. But some populated places have already used the new system, for example Slobozhanske upgrading from selyshche to misto as it is densely populated and passess the population threshold. It's still possible to change the status not according to the law though, as Olyka recently did, based on its historic significance rather than population and population density. Shwabb1 ⟨taco⟩ 03:34, 6 May 2025 (UTC)

"populated place" is a synonym to "(human) settlement". Yes silskyi naselenyi punkt covers both, so what? "Tree" covers both "birch" and "oak". And I am suggesting to split the types, but after some thinking, maybe you are right. I am self-reverting and let's wait if anybody else pays attentoin to this. --Altenmann >talk 16:50, 5 May 2025 (UTC)

Sure. If/when the topic is brought up again, feel free to ping me in the discussion any time. Shwabb1 ⟨taco⟩ 03:34, 6 May 2025 (UTC)

Please note that "Old Russian" includes everything up to the 17th century (before the Petrine reforms). I did not think it made sense to refer to "Kievan Rus' architecture" when talking about late medieval or early modern buildings (before it was replaced with Russian Baroque). I also see no evidence it is considered to be a feature of Ukrainian or Belarusian architecture. Thanks. Mellk (talk) 11:29, 6 May 2025 (UTC)

I see, "Old Russian" often refers to Kievan Rus' in the Russian language but I suppose it could cover later periods as well. Though does it make sense to refer to it as Russian when it is not only found in Russia? From the information I could find, it seems to me that zakomara appeared in the Kievan Rus' period (with examples in modern-day Ukraine, Belarus, and Russia - thus it's part of architecture of all three countries), but later it was mostly revived in Russia, not so much in the other two. As per the GUE article on kokoshnik (false zakomara), some examples in Ukraine are listed, but that's different from the "true" zakomara. Shwabb1 ⟨taco⟩ 12:18, 6 May 2025 (UTC)

It depends. For example, The Oxford Handbook of Byzantine Art and Architecture refers to it as a Byzantine prototype and that it only became distinctly Russian after the 12th century. Landmarks of Russian Architecture by William Craft Brumfield for example mentions early examples in Kievan Rus' but refers to it as a distinctive feature in Russian churches only later. We can mention the early examples in Belarus and Ukraine for sure, but with the caveat that this was still under Byzantine influence. Mellk (talk) 12:38, 6 May 2025 (UTC)

For example The Oxford Handbook of Byzantine Art and Architecture, when referring to the new church in Vladimir, says: "In contrast to earlier Byzantine churches of this plan, the cubical form of the church has been raised considerably, creating proportionally tall interior spaces, with the whole surmounted by a very tall drum holding what was originally a hemispherical dome." (p. 380). Mellk (talk) 12:42, 6 May 2025 (UTC)

I think that's a good way of putting it. Originally it was a part of Kievan Rus' architecture with Byzantine influence, but it stayed and continued developing only in Russia after the collapse of the Rus'. Shwabb1 ⟨taco⟩ 12:50, 6 May 2025 (UTC)

The architecture of Kievan Rus' was more or less a dependency of Byzantine architecture. This is considered to be a separate period. Then it began to develop on independent lines after the 12th century, after the disintegration of Kievan Rus', with different regional schools. Then after the Mongol conquest, there was more of a focus on restoration efforts and masonry building in new regional centers. Mellk (talk) 13:13, 6 May 2025 (UTC)

Thanks for your contributions to House of Projects. Unfortunately, I do not think it is ready for publishing at this time because it needs more sources to establish notability. I have converted your article to a draft which you can improve, undisturbed for a while.

Please see more information at Help:Unreviewed new page. When the article is ready for publication, please click on the "Submit the draft for review!" button at the top of the page OR move the page back. Warm Regards, Miminity (Talk?) (me contribs) 10:57, 8 May 2025 (UTC)

It's a translation of an existing page at Ukrainian Wikipedia, but yes it does lack sources. Definitely meets notability as it's a part of the larger ensemble of Freedom Square (with Derzhprom being more famous), which is planned to be nominated as a World Heritage Site. I did plan to find more sources anyway. Shwabb1 ⟨taco⟩ 11:36, 8 May 2025 (UTC)

Hi @Shwabb1:! I suggest expand the article on the draftspace then either move it to mainspace or summit it for review at WP:AFC. The article currently has a one inline citation. I also want to point out that Notability is not inherited. Warm Regards, Miminity (Talk?) (me contribs) 11:40, 8 May 2025 (UTC)

Sure, I'm already in the process of adding some citations and extra info. But I do believe still that it is notable -- it's one of the earlier constructivist buildings in USSR, and it only gets less coverage than Derzhprom because it was rebuilt with some features in a different style. Less famous doesn't mean less notable either. But I think the sources will cover the notability requirements once I'm done. Shwabb1 ⟨taco⟩ 11:50, 8 May 2025 (UTC)

@Miminity I've added some references. Take a look if you're not busy and tell me if that's enough to move the page back to mainspace. Shwabb1 ⟨taco⟩ 13:00, 8 May 2025 (UTC)

I believe it's good enough so I'm moving it, though do tell me if you think it needs more references. Shwabb1 ⟨taco⟩ 06:55, 10 May 2025 (UTC)

The final point for consonants at Ukrainian phonology is that Dental plosives /t, tʲ, d, dʲ/ assimilate to affricate articulations before coronal affricates or fricatives /t͡s, d͡z, s, z, t͡sʲ, d͡zʲ, sʲ, zʲ, t͡ʃ, d͡ʒ, ʃ, ʒ/ and assume the latter consonant’s place of articulation and palatalization. I noticed it after I had made and edit here where this rule had been applied to the transcription. That would also mean that /d/+/t͡ʃ/ becomes [d͡ʒt͡ʃ], right? ~ IvanScrooge98 (talk) 09:42, 3 June 2025 (UTC)

I just looked at the source, and I believe what this section was trying to reference is 2.6 Assimilation, 2) Assimilation by place and manner of articulation, specifically this part: "The stop represented by < т > before < ч, ш > becomes /ʧ/: коротший /kɔrɔʧʧɪj/; The stop represented by < т > before < ц > becomes /ʦ/: коритце /kɔrɪʦʦɛ/." These statements seem correct to me, they're just worded in a strange way in Ukrainian phonology.

So in other words:

/t/ + /ʃ/ = /t͡ʃ:/, e.g. коротше [koˈrɔtʃ:e]

/t/ + /t͡ʃ/ = /t͡ʃ:/, e.g. хутчіш [xʊˈtʃ:iʃ]

/t/ + /t͡s/ = /t͡s:/, e.g. коритце [koˈrɪts:e]

While they're not mentioned in the above quote, these pairs also have assimilation:

/d/ + /t͡ʃ/ = /t͡ʃ:/, e.g. Богородчани [boɦoroˈtʃ:ɑnɪ]

/d/ + /t͡s/ = /t͡s:/, e.g. молодці [moloˈts:i]

/t/ + /s/ = /t͡s/, e.g. братство [ˈbrɑtstwo]

/t/ + /sʲ/ = /t͡sʲ/, e.g. азіатський [ɐzʲiˈɑtsʲkɪj]

/t/ + /t͡sʲ/ = /t͡sʲ:/, e.g. золотця [ˈzɔlotsʲ:ɐ]

/tʲ/ + /sʲ/ = /t͡sʲ:/, e.g. робиться [ˈrɔbɪtsʲ:ɐ]

/dʲ/ + /sʲ/ = /d͡zʲsʲ/, e.g. людський [lʲʊˈdzʲsʲkɪj]

/d/ + /z/ = /d͡zz/ only when /d/ is part of a prefix, and /z/ is part of the stem, e.g. надзвичайно [nɐdzzwɪˈtʃɑjno]

/d/ + /s/ = /d͡zs/ only when /d/ is part of a prefix, and /z/ is part of the stem, e.g. надсекретний [nɐdzseˈkrɛtnɪj]

Shwabb1 ⟨taco⟩ 12:33, 3 June 2025 (UTC)

It’s interesting that /dt͡ʃ/ and /dt͡s/ would be the only cases in Ukrainian where devoicing happens though. ~ IvanScrooge98 (talk) 12:38, 3 June 2025 (UTC)

I also thought that this is strange but that seems correct. I've watched quite a few videos related to Bohorodchany, and everyone pronounces /tʃ:/, both locals and TV hosts. See also this audio file of відчувати. Wiktionary insists on /d͡ʒt͡ʃ/, but there's clearly only one sound there.

I've just looked into what Modern Standard Ukrainian Language textbook (currently reference 5 in Ukrainian phonology) has to say, and, confusingly, in one part they claim that тш, тч, дш, дч are all pronounced /d͡ʒ/ or /t͡ʃ:/ depending on placement, while in another section, дч in відчистити is transcribed as /d͡ʒt͡ʃ/ (which sounds very strange to me). Same thing for дц: first /ts:/, later /d͡zt͡s/. Shwabb1 ⟨taco⟩ 13:01, 3 June 2025 (UTC)

So it’s either free variation or the case has been overlooked. Again, I trust you as a native speaker, and most stuff seems to point to full assimilation. Let’s see if we can find some more straightforward source about that. ~ IvanScrooge98 (talk) 13:13, 3 June 2025 (UTC)

This paper on the pronunciation of standard Ukrainian through history states the following: " 'Khutirna poezia' by P. Kulish testifies to the assimilation of /dt͡ʃ/, /tt͡ʃ/ -> /t͡ʃ:/. Such assimilation was considered in the works of linguists as a pronunciation norm. But in modern orthoepy, /d/ before hissing sounds is assimilated to /d͡ʒ/." So it seems that modern standard Ukrainian dictates that /d͡ʒt͡ʃ/ is correct (even though this still sounds unusual to me), while /t͡ʃ:/ is a common pronunciation. Shwabb1 ⟨taco⟩ 13:18, 3 June 2025 (UTC)

I was about to link you to a related paper that apparently refers to [t͡ʃː] as an “incorrect” pronunciation among younger speakers as opposed to prescriptive [d͡ʒt͡ʃ]; it seems to confirm what you just said. So I guess we could list them both, one being natural and one prescriptive? ~ IvanScrooge98 (talk) 13:25, 3 June 2025 (UTC)

Sure, that should work. Shwabb1 ⟨taco⟩ 13:30, 3 June 2025 (UTC)

I just looked at the source. It doesn’t describe devoicing other than for г and the з prefix/preposition. ~ IvanScrooge98 (talk) 12:49, 3 June 2025 (UTC)

Dear Shwabb1,

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Hi again Shwabb. I was thinking about proceeding with the completion of the example list on the IPA key, particularly showing obstruent-voicing, as I was telling you. Since I don’t speak the language, I cannot spontaneously come up with examples. If you can indicate me some words with /p t tʲ ts tsʲ tʃ k s sʲ ʃ/ assimilating their voicing to the following voiced consonant, I can add them myself to the page. Thanks in advance! ~ IvanScrooge98 (talk) 20:21, 6 June 2025 (UTC)

/p/ - крепдешин [krebdeˈʃɪn] (the only word I could find for this, seems quite rare)

/t/ - отже [ˈodʒe]

/tʲ/ - боротьба [borodʲˈbɑ]

/ts/ - плацдарм [plɐdzˈdɑrm]

/tsʲ/ - I couldn't think of anything, and looked through various dictionaries but couldn't find a singular word for this. Might occur in some obsure loanword or vernacularism, or possibly doesn't occur in any individual words at all.

/tʃ/ - лічба [lidʒˈbɑ]

/k/ - рюкзак [rʲʊgˈzɑk]

/s/ - бейсбол [bejzˈbɔl]

/sʲ/ - просьба [ˈprɔzʲbɐ]

/ʃ/ - Вишгород [ˈwɪʒɦorod]

Shwabb1 ⟨taco⟩ 06:07, 7 June 2025 (UTC)

Thanks a lot! I’m going to work on that. ~ IvanScrooge98 (talk) 07:03, 7 June 2025 (UTC)

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Overall, your edits to Wikipedia are very good and I would like to take this moment to thank you for them. However, we all make mistakes sometimes that we can learn from. When you made this edit to List of World Heritage Sites in Iraq, you violated a part of the Manual of Style. Not a big deal, and it happened some months ago, but I thought that I would tell you so that you would know from now on. Don't try to fix them right now as I already am updating the list to meet FL standards and would not want an edit conflict. Thanks 🇪🇭🇵🇸🇸🇩 Easternsahara 🇪🇭🇵🇸🇸🇩 00:29, 3 September 2025 (UTC)

Hello. Thanks for the heads up. I believe, in that particular case, I updated the tentative list and simply followed the pre-existing style that already violated the MOS (though I wasn't aware of that back then). I often don't have the time and will to get all WHS lists in proper shape so thank you for putting your effort into improving them. Shwabb1 ⟨taco⟩ 10:41, 3 September 2025 (UTC)

Hi Shwabb, wondering if you have any village/rural settlement/city article you've worked on/saw that you think would serve as a good model for formatting infoboxes in all the other populated place articles? The WP:AutoWikiBrowser manual bot helps publish large amounts of technical, formatting-type edits like the ones you've been doing for populated places and I thought it could help make it a lot easier by taking some of the work away using it (also can help introduce you to the bot if you'd like to use it too). It can't help with everything but some of the simpler tasks it's quite good at handling. I started doing a bit a few days ago but stopped after realizing there's some inconsistencies between articles I'm not too sure how to handle (specifically, should Template:UKR or just Ukraine (no flag icon) be used in the infobox? Should all infoboxes have it| subdivision_type = [[List of sovereign states|Country]] or Country or with no link?)

Also thinking if I'll be running the bot, might help to publish the City status so I can replace | settlement_type = [[List of cities in Ukraine|City]] with the City status link though also can easily do it in the future anyways. Planning to make a stub at Rural settlement (Ukraine) to help get it going and so the links for it can be added too (similar to how I'm hoping City status and Village (Ukraine) will be linked into the infobox).

And have to say don't think I can ever say thanks enough for all your amazing work on wiki :) Especially thanks for your FLNs (which I hope to give good reviews when I have more time) and the City status article and everything in between. Dan the Animator 21:22, 22 November 2025 (UTC)

Thanks for finding the bot. I agree that it can speed up the process quite a bit. I don't have one particular article example in mind, but after looking at a few random city articles, Bilhorod-Dnistrovskyi seems good. In terms of MOS / guidelines, I'm not sure which option for the country field is most "correct". Personally, I think including the country flag is fine as it is recognizable globally (unlike regional flags), though I could also see how it could be excluded to have consistent entries. Linking the country makes sense because the other administrative divisions are linked, although I remember seeing editors specifically changing Template:UKR to Template:Flagu which removes the link (no idea why that would be an improvement). I have had a conversation about flags in infoboxes with another user a while ago, and we reached the conclusion that regional flags shouldn't be included (although MOS:INFOBOXFLAG technically allows first-level administrative division flags), but the national flag can be left in, though I don't think it's necessary. If it were entirely up to me, I'd go with Template:UKR (flag and link). When editing Template:Infobox settlement in the visual editor, [[List of sovereign states|Country]] is given as an example for the subdivision_type field, so that's what I've been using (though I didn't notice immediately so I haven't added that to all the city articles).

As for the City status article, I'm essentially done with the legislation section for now. I still want to expand the history and lead a bit so that it feels more complete (though of course it can be expanded and improved later). I'll try to finish up the main points in a few days (maybe even tomorrow) and move it to mainspace. Also, I got the idea from a comment directed to you in FLN of List of cities in Odesa so feel free to make any additions/changes even if the page is still in my userspace. And yes, a separate Rural settlement (Ukraine) article makes sense to me as well.

On a different topic, you seemed interested in expanding the List of Kyiv Metro stations, so what do you think about working on bringing that list to FL together some time in the future? Doesn't have to be soon of course, especially considering that I have two active FLNs and also working on another list, and you seem busy at the moment as well. Thank you too for all your edits on various articles. Shwabb1 ⟨taco⟩ 22:47, 22 November 2025 (UTC)

Bilhorod-Dnistrovskyi looks like a good model for the infobox and for the reasons you stated and also considering it's more simple/uses less markup, Template:UKR is probably what I'll standardize it with. I'll also add in the List of sovereign states link for the pages I cover since it doesn't hurt to have it. Feel free to take your time with the City status article; I'll just do a bot run on those articles once you have it published and it's helpful too since the majority of the articles that need editing are villages/rural settlements, not really the cities.

I haven't been able to help as much as I want to so far because of a lot of off-wiki work but I'll definitely be contributing a bit too eventually to the city status article, which already looks great :) And thanks for creating it: it was a very pleasant surprise and I think it'll help resume with the promotion of the rest of the oblast cities lists, which I stopped mainly because of the need to research the topic more and to create that article. You mentioned finishing the legislation section and also made great updates to the city lists the past day so wondering what do you think of their promotability? I felt the lists could use some of the legislative/governance info that municipality FLs like List of municipalities in Granada have though wondering what you think?

Also List of Kyiv Metro stations would be a great project. I admittedly haven't worked on it in a while but I'll help on it when I can and feel free to leave a to-do list on it for anything you'd like me to work on or if there's any particularly time consuming formatting/monotonous tasks still to be finished/done (I have a long commute on some weekdays so I might be able to especially help with those less interesting tasks on those days). Feel free to start the FL nomination for it too when you think it's ready and I'd be excited anytime to work together on another joint nomination. Dan the Animator 23:40, 22 November 2025 (UTC)

Considering that six Ukrainian city lists have already been promoted to FL, I think the same structure could be used for others and a lot of them may already be more or less ready (some are missing images but that's easy to fix). While I could see how mentioning some more info on governance would make sense, I don't think it should be done as much as in List of municipalities in Granada. The equivalent of a municipality in Ukraine is a hromada. Not all hromadas are centered around cities, and not all cities host hromada administrations, so the scope seems a bit different. Reading through the (current) local government and administration laws, there doesn't seem to be any practical difference between urban, settlement, or rural hromadas (except for some minor things, e.g., rural hromadas with fewer than 500 residents don't have to form an executive committee). Cities have the power to form urban districts, but in reality this is only needed for large cities. At the same time, city status is seen as prestigious and desirable, with some articles I found claiming that it makes the settlement look more appealing to investors and more visible to the general population. I even found a claim that cities tend to receive more funding from above, although I'm not sure if there's any real data proving that. So far, city status doesn't seem to bring any legal quirks (except urban districts, and I'm still looking into other laws to see whether there's more) but offers other benefits that come from prestige alone. Also, one interesting case I haven't mentioned in the article yet is when Slobozhanske, Dnipropetrovsk Oblast pulled out of applying for city status because it allegedly necessitates the creation of a separate utilities system and a possible tax increase on public transport and water (source), though so far I am unable to confirm that these claims are true. If I find anything special about cities in other laws, then I think that information should be mentioned in the lists of cities. But anyway, I really like the idea of all the city lists getting to FL, and maybe also getting the city status article to GA and then nominating all that as a featured topic.

And as for the Kyiv Metro stations list, I think it mostly needs work on the lead and maybe a statistics section like in List of Great Northern route stations. Some small things that probably need to be mentioned is that a few stations have side platforms (most are island), and that some stations are also protected as heritage sites. Currently lacking sources as well. The depths of the stations need to be confirmed, and alt text is missing. I think the formatting is generally OK, but if you think of any improvements then feel free to implement them. Shwabb1 ⟨taco⟩ 09:48, 23 November 2025 (UTC)

That makes sense and interesting case with Slobozhanske. Maybe not as much detail as the Granada list but some of the things you mentioned feel like they would be good additions, specifically: which cities are also coextensively hromadas and maybe stating briefly in the lead that, since 2020, the legal equivalent of municipalities in Ukraine are hromadas. Also putting it context so that maybe it first discusses the pre-2020 City of regional significance (Ukraine) status and the local governance rights that came with that, directly followed by stating the 2020 reform and briefly explaining which rights were transferred to the hromadas, to the cities themselves, and/or elsewhere. Also maybe adding in the pre-2020 discussion with a bit more specific info about what used to be some of the differences in rights between City of district significance (Ukraine) and the regional cities.

I think a mention of the process of applying for and being granted city status might be a good thing to include too though the current wording might already be enough for this. Also agree urban districts are an important thing to mention where they exist though doesn't have to be so detailed. Probably just a sentence saying which ones have them, how many each city has, the ability of a city's local government to devolve some of their city-wide powers to the individual districts, and that would be it. I had it in mind to make the lists more detailed using the footnote strategy we used in the derussification list to explain the more specific things (so maybe having one footnote listing all the considerations taken into account by parliament for granting city status; another footnote listing a sample of key specific rights that cities currently have; and other similar technicalities or things that take up space).

And fully agree about making it a featured topic. I already made a Progress tracker for that (will have to figure out how to add in the City status article to it too but should be doable) and a few other potential FTs I thought of and feel free to add other FT ideas you have to my tracker userpage. For the Kyiv Metro list, I'll see what I can do and added in your suggestions in a comment on the top to help with it. I might add that once the Kyiv Metro list is promoted, it could be a good model for the other metro systems and eventually lead to another FT too. Dan the Animator 16:52, 23 November 2025 (UTC)

A tag has been placed on Category:WikiProject Ukrainian subdivisions articles indicating that it is currently empty, and is not a disambiguation category, a category redirect, under discussion at Categories for discussion, or a project category that by its nature may become empty on occasion. If it remains empty for seven days or more, it may be deleted under section C1 of the criteria for speedy deletion.

If you think this page should not be deleted for this reason you may contest the nomination by visiting the page and removing the speedy deletion tag. Liz ^{Read! Talk!} 17:39, 30 November 2025 (UTC)

Hi Shwabb great work with the taskforce edits! I know you're busy though wanted to reach out in case given your great translation skills. I was hoping to use two Wikisource documents, this and this, but they don't have English translations available. I've been mostly relying on the Google Translate but there's a few words/phrases it translates poorly and given the age of the documents, I think your insight would be helpful. I also didn't do a complete search to see if there's any English translations already available but thought it would be good to ask in any case since your translation, if you decide to add it, can be made part of Wikisource. Let me know if you'd be interested in translating or vetting the documents and many thanks for everything as always. Dan the Animator 04:53, 2 December 2025 (UTC)

Hello. I just finished translating the first document. Wikisource policy seems to discourage links in the main text, but I'd like to point out some useful links if you need extra info, namely Hetman of all Ukraine, Central Rada, Minor Rada, and zemlia. "Ukrainian Soim" was the planned name of the newly formed parliament under the Ukrainian State. "Comrades" in the original meant deputy ministers, which is what I used for clarity. I'll get to the second document soon as well. I will also continue working on the City status article as soon as I'm done with including all raion categories and articles in the subdivisions task force. Shwabb1 ⟨taco⟩ 14:00, 2 December 2025 (UTC)

Also, that was an interesting read. The occasional strange spelling is also peculiar (the language wasn't standardized back then), so I see why a translator app may struggle with some parts. I'm actually not too familiar with details around the UPR / Ukrainian State periods so thanks for finding these. Shwabb1 ⟨taco⟩ 14:03, 2 December 2025 (UTC)

Thanks Shwabb! :) Just read through it and the translation looks flawless. Also, thanks for the links, no rush with anything and sounds good. I'll try to help a bit with adding the right articles to the taskforce too. And guessing you're curious so probably should say, I'm a university student doing my honors thesis on Ukrainian diplomacy during the 1918-1921 era (though these two documents are for unrelated research) so definitely can have more conversations about it in the future if you're interested. It's a fascinating important topic and I have to give some special credit to you for increasing my interest in it when we worked on the derussification list. Dan the Animator 15:34, 2 December 2025 (UTC)

The second is done as well. Though, I had to rely significantly on Google Translate and online dictionaries and thesauruses for this one as it contains a lot of jargon (especially article 7) but I looked through everything a few times so it should be good. FYI, "Otaman of the Rada of Ministers" and "Otaman-Minister" refer to the same position.

Interesting and makes sense that you're doing research on Ukraine. Of course you can ask or tell me anything about this. I know some general things about the time period but haven't looked deep into it considering how complex and messy it is, but that's what makes it interesting. If you don't mind answering, I'm more curious why you're interested in Ukraine in general? Thank you for contributing so much to Wikipedia on the topic of Ukraine regardless. Shwabb1 ⟨taco⟩ 19:21, 2 December 2025 (UTC)

On 23 December 2025, Did you know was updated with a fact from the article Geographical indications in Ukraine, which you recently created, substantially expanded, or brought to good article status. The fact was ... that Ukraine protects more than 3,000 geographical indications, only thirty of which originate in the country? The nomination discussion and review may be seen at Template:Did you know nominations/Geographical indications in Ukraine. You are welcome to check how many pageviews the nominated article or articles got while on the front page (here's how, Geographical indications in Ukraine), and the hook may be added to the statistics page after its run on the Main Page has completed. Finally, if you know of an interesting fact from another recently created article, then please feel free to nominate it.

 — Amakuru (talk) 00:03, 23 December 2025 (UTC)

Hi, Shwabb1. I'm just posting to let you know that List of Intangible Cultural Heritage elements in Ukraine – a list that you have been heavily involved with – has been chosen to appear on the Main Page as Today's featured list for January 21, 2026. The TFL blurb can be seen here. If you have any thoughts on the selection, please post them on my talk page or at TFL talk. --PresN 16:15, 30 December 2025 (UTC)

Hello Shwabb1, your recent request at Wikipedia:Requested moves/Technical requests has been removed because it remained inactive for seventy-two hours after being contested. If you would like to proceed with your original request, please follow the directions at Wikipedia:Requested moves/Controversial.

This notification was delivered by TenshiBot. You can opt out of future notifications by placing {{bots|deny=TenshiBot}} on the top of your current page (your user talk page) TenshiBot (talk) 12:00, 21 February 2026 (UTC)