Talk:Haifa

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The citation for "The railway increased the city's volume of trade, and attracted workers and foreign merchants." is "Mansour, J. (2006). The Hijaz-Palestine railway and the development of Haifa. Jerusalem quarterly, (28)" Jetsetter84 (talk) 03:18, 22 May 2025 (UTC)

 Done Lova Falk (talk) 15:18, 29 May 2025 (UTC)

@Reenem: back in 2020 in this edit and a series of other edits around the same time, you added in some information from the Jewish Virtual Library (subsequently established as generally unreliable, per WP:RSPJVL).

You added in that edit: ”In 1742, Haifa was a small village located at the foot of Mount Carmel near the area of the present day Bat Galim neighborhood. It had a small Jewish community and synagogue.”

It has subsequently evolved to become: ”In 1742, Haifa was a small village and had a Jewish community composed mainly of immigrants from Morocco and Algeria which had a synagogue.”

This Jewish majority claim seems extremely unlikely. It is not in the JVL source, but nor is any reference to 1742. In fact much of what you added in that 2020 edit is not in the linked JVL source.

Is there another source that was intended to be linked to?

Onceinawhile (talk) 16:05, 27 November 2025 (UTC)

@Onceinawhile: "From the 1720s onwards, most travellers mention Arab Muslims, Jews and Christians among the inhabitants of the town. Towards the middle of the eighteenth century, the number of Christians increased, undoubtedly on account of the activity of the Carmelites, so that, as one of the friars remarks, a church in Haifa became necessary. For all that, Haifa remained a village with a Muslim majority, a fact that left its mark on the place for many years to come." -- Alex Carmel, Ottoman Haifa, p15. This source might answer your other question too. I'm too busy in rl but I can send you the source if you can't find it. Zero^talk 02:53, 28 November 2025 (UTC)

The article says It had 250 inhabitants in 1764–5. It was located at Tell el-Semak, the site of ancient Sycaminum. In 1765, Zahir al-Umar, the Arab ruler of Acre and the Galilee, moved the population to a new fortified site 1.5 mi (2.4 km) to the east.

Yet these two maps from before the alleged move appear to contradict the suggestion that Old Haifa was at Tel Shikmona. Both show Haifa located at roughly the same position it was located in during the 1800s. Onceinawhile (talk) 17:21, 27 November 2025 (UTC) Sources I have found so far:

• Joudah, Ahmad Hasan (2013). Revolt in Palestine in the Eighteenth Century: The Era of Shaykh Zahir Al-Umar. Gorgias Press. p. 24-25. ISBN 978-1-4632-0002-2. After Zahir successfully occupied the above two villages, the coastal plain, and Marj ibn 'Amir, he turned his attention to Haifa. It was a small, neglected village on the southern coast of the bay of 'Akka, and enjoyed a better location and natural harbor than that of 'Akka itself. Haifa was used by many foreign and local merchants to avoid paying the customs to the proper authorities in 'Akka. In addition, it was used by the Maltese pirates as a refuge. Haifa was within the domain of Ibn Madi and Ibn Jarrar, and thus a part of the Damascus province. Zahir decided to annex Haifa for its strategic importance and as a potential port for the hinterland, which he controlled. Zahir also wanted to deprive the pashas of Damascus and their local allies of an important strategic position from which they could attack him and threaten his control over the Galilee. Therefore, he destroyed Haifa on the pretext that it was being used as a refuge by the "infidel pirates," and established, not far from its location but within his borders, another village called al-'Imarah al-Jadidah, which later became known as Haifa al-Jadidah (New Haifa).
• J. A. Egmont and J. Heyman, Travels Through Parts of Europe, Syria, Palestine, Egypt (London: 1759) 2-6: "BEFORE we reached Caipha, now a small village lying in our way, we faw several ruins of houses and churches, said to have been anciently the city Porphyria; and in a quarter of an hour more, we reached the above-mentioned village, which at present is inhabited by Arabian peasants, who are continually at war with the people residing near St. John d'Acri, and form a small republic, which has often been known to oppose the tyranny of the Pashas, to whom they pay tribute, if they please them, but not otherwise. Some of the neighbouring villages are in alliance with the small republic of Caipha, and thus, by their combined force, secure themselves from the violences of those petty tyrants… But to return to the village Caipha, called by the inhabitants, Heiffa, where we saw the ruins of an ancient church and tower. The inhabitants pretended that their village owed its name to the high-priest Caiphas; and that he himself built the town afterwards called Porphyria. The ground near Caipha is the best for anchoring of any on the whole coast, being much safer than St. John d'Acri; so that the Corsairs generally put in here to sell their prizes, which chiefly consist of rice and slaves: And on these occasions one of the Carmelite monks performs the office of interpreter between the pirates and inhabitants. Tho while we were there, the French Vice-consul of St. John d'Acri strictly forbad the fathers from acting any more in that capacity. CAIPHA, as we have already said, lies at the foot of mount Carmel, on the shore of the Mediterranean, and directly opposite to St. John d'Acri, the sea having formed a bay betwixt them. The houses are small, and flat-roofed, where, during the summer, the inhabitants sleep in arbours made of the boughs of trees. In the mean time the fathers of mount Carmel, who live in harmony with the inhabitants of this village, being their nearest neighbours, can send them the most speedy assistance on exigences."

Onceinawhile (talk) 00:29, 28 November 2025 (UTC)

@Oncenawhile: There is a little more detail about this in Zahir al-Umar#Haifa (better than what this article offers about the subject). It is well established that Zahir demolished the ‘old’ Haifa and founded a new village close by. See Yazbak (1998) pp. 13-15. There are more sources about this, but I have to dig a little. —Al Ameer (talk) 03:23, 28 November 2025 (UTC)

Yes, there are quite a few sources about the destruction and reestablishment. I'm not sure that these maps have sufficient resolution to definitely refute that. Zero^talk 07:29, 28 November 2025 (UTC)

Thanks both. Very helpful. FWIW, I am not questioning the destruction / restablishment (although would like to check the extent), I am questioning the distance the town was moved, and whether it is correct to say that Old Haifa was located at Tell el Samak. Onceinawhile (talk) 08:02, 28 November 2025 (UTC)

I haven’t read Zero’s source yet, but Al Ameer's answers all the questions. It was not at Tel el Samak at all. It was at the western end of today’s commercial port, south of Ras al Kurum. Known as Haifa al Atiqa (Old Haifa). Can be seen on this map and in this description. Onceinawhile (talk) 09:21, 28 November 2025 (UTC)

I looked at some archaeology wrt Tel Samak and didn't see anything about Ottoman-period settlement. Zero^talk 11:20, 28 November 2025 (UTC)

The location shown in Pococke‘s 1745 map above matches with Yazbak’s / Haifa al Atiqa, as does another sentence already in the article By Hellenistic times, the city had moved to a new site south of what is now the Bat Galim neighborhood sourced to Encyclopedia Judaica. Onceinawhile (talk) 19:25, 28 November 2025 (UTC)

Here is what EJ says (vol 8, p 235):

In 1742 Haifa again came into existence as a village or a small town located at the foot of Mt. Carmel near the present-day Bat Gallim quarter. It had a small Jewish community and a synagogue. In the middle of the century Zahir annexed Haifa as well. Unfortified and spread over a wide and vulnerable plain, Haifa was almost captured in 1761 by the Turks. To prevent its falling into his enemies’ hands, Zahir ordered his soldiers to raze the city to the ground and scatter boulders in the anchorage; thus the ancient city of Haifa was demolished. Zahir provided his growing capital with a safe alternative port of call 1⅓ mi. (2 km.) southeast of ancient Haifa, on a strip of coast at the foot of the Carmel at an easily defensible point. Unlike the ancient city of Haifa, the new port was situated on the crossroad from Acre to Jaffa. Zahir walled in the area and built another fortress on the slope above (known as the Burj, located on the site of Castrum Samaritanorum).

Zero^talk 01:20, 29 November 2025 (UTC)

Thank you. FWIW, the suggestion that Zahir moved the city from Tell es-Samak to its modern location was added by Tiamut in 2011 and has survived ever since. I have done the following to try to clear up the confusion:

• Created the article Haifa el-Atika
• Created the article Shikmona, as recent research has broken its connection with Tell es-Samak.
• Fixed the article Porphyreon, which had been very confusing.
• Created the article Old City of Haifa, as the last remaining component of the historical story
• Added some links to Tell Abu Hawam

I will amend this article once the others are done. Onceinawhile (talk) 10:14, 30 November 2025 (UTC)

• Hi all. Sorry for the confusion, but I made that edit based on Moshe Sharon's text here. Not sure that I misunderstood his text, but its clearly wrong. Thanks for all your work fixing it. Tiamut (talk) 06:50, 10 January 2026 (UTC)

Thanks for the efforts so far, Oncenawhile. Taking a look at things and considering the new articles you've created, I'm rethinking the need to have a separate History of Haifa article, which I started back in 2008 by copying over material from here. This article's history section has offered much more information than the History of Haifa article for many years now. It seems like an unnecessary fork with a tiny fraction of the views that this article receives and thus a disservice to interested readers. Once you are finished with your basic outline of things in this article, I'd like to start consolidating the History-related material here as well and redirect History of Haifa to Haifa#History. --Al Ameer (talk) 19:44, 30 November 2025 (UTC)

That makes a lot of sense to me. Thank you Al Ameer. Onceinawhile (talk) 21:15, 30 November 2025 (UTC)

Hi @Al Ameer son: I have now completed the history section at Old City of Haifa, using citations with detailed quotes to explain the complexity of the two predecessors. I believe this is now the best version we have, better than the relevant parts of both the history section of this article and the History of Haifa.

I have also put the Old City article up for DYK, with a hook focused on the three different Old Cities, to explain the complexity more widely.

I have fixed the “Locations and names“ section of this article, but have left the history section mostly untouched.

I will not edit the history section here or at History of Haifa, so please feel free to begin the consolidation whenever you are ready.

Onceinawhile (talk) 21:41, 2 December 2025 (UTC)

@Oncenawhile: Great—done. Not a whole lot to merge (mostly your recent additions to the Ottoman period). Most of the information in History of Haifa was already present in this article's History section. Other info was not supported by RS, so was left out. Will do a once-over, then redirect History of Haifa to Haifa#History.

On the subject of RS, I think tour-haifa.co.il, Haifa Municipality and The Guide to Israel are probably not RS, particularly on matters of history. JVL too (though Enyclopedia Judaica, which JVL often uses, is). Now that the two articles have been (re)merged, a revamp is in order for the History section and should rely on higher quality sources, of which there are plenty about this city. --Al Ameer (talk) 04:59, 3 December 2025 (UTC)

Thank you Al Ameer. Agree there are a huge number of quality sources available. The bibliography I have started building at Old City of Haifa is hopefully a good start. Onceinawhile (talk) 07:17, 3 December 2025 (UTC)

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Under the British Mandate section, change "Baha'i" to "Bahá’ís" -There are two instances of this error. Tempo44 (talk) 08:51, 1 December 2025 (UTC)

 Done: Thanks for catching that. SI09 (talk) 12:16, 1 December 2025 (UTC)

What kind of ship does the coat of arms show? Is it a Cog, something else, or "just" a drawn picture without specific background? Stubenviech (talk) 22:02, 3 February 2026 (UTC)

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Change the word "abotive" to "abortive". Danyelling12 (talk) 17:03, 9 March 2026 (UTC)

Partly done: changed the word to brief. Thanks for pointing out the error! ScrubbedFalcon (talk) 20:22, 9 March 2026 (UTC)