Talk:Hurricane Ivan
From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
| This is the talk page for discussing improvements to the Hurricane Ivan article. This is not a forum for general discussion of the subject of the article. |
Article policies
|
| Find sources: Google (books · news · scholar · free images · WP refs) · FENS · JSTOR · TWL |
| Archives: 1 |
 | Hurricane Ivan was one of the Natural sciences good articles, but it has been removed from the list. There are suggestions below for improving the article to meet the good article criteria. Once these issues have been addressed, the article can be renominated. Editors may also seek a reassessment of the decision if they believe there was a mistake. | |||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
| ||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
 | This article is rated C-class on Wikipedia's content assessment scale. It is of interest to the following WikiProjects: | |||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
| ||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
Priority 2 |
 | Section sizes
| ||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
Total deaths is wrong.
The total deaths should be 121, not 120, but the page is semi-protected and I can't update it. Jagmarz (talk) 22:41, 28 September 2022 (UTC)
Semi-protected edit request on 19 October 2022
 | This edit request has been answered. Set the |answered= parameter to no to reactivate your request. |
Under Hurricane Ivan#Florida (for impacts), please add {{see also|Effects of Hurricane Ivan in Florida]] 69.118.235.133 (talk) 22:06, 19 October 2022 (UTC)
Partly done: Used Template:Main instead of Template:See also since article primarily uses the former, but request complete. —Sirdog (talk) 01:56, 20 October 2022 (UTC)
Semi-protected edit request on 20 August 2023
| This edit request has been answered. Set the |answered= parameter to no to reactivate your request. |
Please add, under Hurricane Ivan#Alabama, a link to {{main|Effects of Hurricane Ivan in Alabama}} 199.76.112.12 (talk) 17:15, 20 August 2023 (UTC)
Merge Effects of Hurricane Ivan in Alabama and Effects of Hurricane Ivan in Florida?
- The following discussion is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section. A summary of the conclusions reached follows.
Both of these sub articles are very short, and at only 4613 words, this article can definitely handle the extra content. Therefore, I am proposing a merger. 12.74.53.67 (talk) 21:21, 10 September 2024 (UTC)
- Just want to mention that I have boldly merged the Florida article at it is less than 10k bytes and would most likely be unanimously merged. ZZZ'S 01:08, 12 September 2024 (UTC)
The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.
Semi-protected edit request on 21 April 2025
| This edit request has been answered. Set the |answered= parameter to no to reactivate your request. |
Please remove the sentence “ However, despite 56 people dying in the United States, none of them were in Alabama. Hurricane Ivan was also the strongest hurricane to hit Alabama since Hurricane Frederic in 1979, which was a Category 4.”, which remains unsourced. 72.89.246.95 (talk) 17:08, 21 April 2025 (UTC)
Not done: Well, I found two sources regarding the sentence,- No Alabama casualities --- https://www.cbs42.com/weather/on-this-day-hurricanes-sally-and-ivan-make-landfall-along-alabama-coast-16-years-apart/
- Worst hurricane to hit Alabama --- https://www.weather.gov/bmx/event_ivan2004?/ Warriorglance(talk to me) 15:07, 5 May 2025 (UTC)
Proposal to merge Effects of Hurricane Ivan in the Lesser Antilles and South America and Effects of Hurricane Ivan in the Greater Antilles
- The following discussion is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section. A summary of the conclusions reached follows.
- Merge, proponents cited short length, which is a WP:MERGEREASON. Minority arguments against were somewhat murky. -- Beland (talk) 08:48, 3 December 2025 (UTC)
The Ivan article right now is only 5,700 words. This includes 650 words about the effects in Lesser Antilles/South America, while the sub-article for that is 2,000 words (some of which would overlap with the main article once merged). Also, the article currently includes about 500 words about the effects in the Greater Antilles, while the sub-article has about 1,500 words. Merging both articles would bring the main Ivan article to close to 8,000 words, which isn't inappropriate for such a big storm, and would probably help, since the current article is on the short side. In the future, if the article proves to continue being too long, then the obvious place to cut content would be about the meteorological history and the tornado outbreak. Just a quick example of some fluff in that department: "A Panama City Beach news station was nearly hit by an F2 tornado during the storm."
Any thoughts? Objections? ♫ Hurricanehink (talk) 18:52, 24 August 2025 (UTC)
- I support this. Let the merge go through. Columbia719 (talk) 00:29, 13 September 2025 (UTC)
- Oppose - I don’t see that being necessary. Just because the word count on the main article is low doesn’t mean you have to merge the subarticles into it, especially if we have to sacrifice content just to make it fit. A big storm like this NEEDS subarticles to make sure all the relevant information is included and I’m not seeing much fluff here honestly. ChessEric 19:23, 27 September 2025 (UTC)
- I don't think we'd have to sacrifice any content. I said there was likely some overlap once the articles were merged, given that the main article already covers the details of the subarticles in some detail. I think the main subarticles needed are the met history and the tornado outbreak, but otherwise I'm not convinced. ♫ Hurricanehink (talk) 21:49, 27 September 2025 (UTC)
- In almost all merges, content is not lost. Only if it would not be appropriate to include in the main article is when content is lost, which is a good thing to improve and maintain the quality of the main article. Merging small subarticles into their main article reduces redundancy and makes information easier to access and manage. Subarticles are needed if the information would be too substantial to include in the main article, which is currently not the case. Considering the word count of the other articles is even lower (not even half of the main article, not combined) and most of the content in the main article is repeated there, it would be beneficial to merge the content. Columbia719 (talk) 22:25, 27 September 2025 (UTC)
- Neither subarticle is small, so what are you talking about? Also, what about the main article is too short? The main problem I see with it is that all of the pictures are on the right side for reason. THAT needs to be fixed. ChessEric 17:55, 9 October 2025 (UTC)
- The Greater Antilles article is on the short side, with about 1,500 words in the body of that article. Ivan's article has 500 words covering the Greater Antilles. Since the Ivan article is relatively short, that would be a natural article to merge, based on the proposal. ♫ Hurricanehink (talk) 18:11, 9 October 2025 (UTC)
- The pictures can easily be addressed. Moving, adding, and removing images is very easy to do and should not be a reason to prevent merges. What I say the subarticles are small, I am describing the amount of information in each subarticle that is not repeated in the main article. The amount is small enough to be incorporated into the main article without causing other problems, at least ones that can't be easily fixed. Also, the main article is missing important information for such a storm that it became one of the reasons why it no longer was a good article. That issue can be partially addressed by merging the subarticles. Expansions are needed as well to fully address the problem, but the merge would be a step in the right direction. After copyedits, the expansions should not be large enough to tip the article over the recommended size limit, given the trends of other storms that had their subarticles merged before being copyedited. My other arguments still stand. Columbia719 (talk) 02:41, 10 October 2025 (UTC)
- Neither subarticle is small, so what are you talking about? Also, what about the main article is too short? The main problem I see with it is that all of the pictures are on the right side for reason. THAT needs to be fixed. ChessEric 17:55, 9 October 2025 (UTC)
- Oppose per ChessEric. Not everything needs merged into something simply because it can be merged. EF5 20:30, 27 September 2025 (UTC)
- Not sure what this comment means. Every merge proposal is independent of each other, but also, if it can be merged into a more appropriate article instead of there being a sub-article, then yea, that's a good reason for merging. 21:49, 27 September 2025 (UTC)♫ Hurricanehink (talk)
- Not sure of what to make of this comment either. The nomination was neither short nor unexplained. FaviFake (talk) 18:40, 7 November 2025 (UTC)
- Support merge. You'd think that the effect of the hurricane would be the main focus of the article about the hurricane. I don't think it ever needed to be split off in the first place. If this merger doesn't take place, then the two articles should at least be merged together into Effects of Hurricane Ivan, but that's a second choice. Thebiguglyalien (talk) 🛸 07:10, 15 November 2025 (UTC)
- Support – per Thebiguglyalien and the articles' short lengths. FaviFake (talk) 10:02, 15 November 2025 (UTC)
- Support per nom. Also, the sections for the Greater Antilles in the Ivan article itself are small and could use the expansion. Jpuxfrd (talk) 20:16, 22 November 2025 (UTC)
- Neutral more information can certainly be added to the article, as I hinted in my edit request below. On the other hand, since the article is considerably below 8,000 bytes, it might be able to handle expansion and merging. ~2025-36320-81 (talk) 15:29, 27 November 2025 (UTC)
The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.
Semi-protected edit request on 27 November 2025
| This edit request has been answered. Set the |answered= parameter to no to reactivate your request. |
At the end of the first paragraph of the elsewhere section, right after the Connecticut fatality mention, please add the following line: In New York City, Ivan severely disrupted the subway system, particularly on the Lexington Avenue Line, which was shut down between Grand Central Terminal and Harlem–125th Street station.
Source: https://www.recordonline.com/story/news/2004/09/19/ivan-s-remnants-saturate-new/51129746007/ ~2025-36320-81 (talk) 15:29, 27 November 2025 (UTC)
- I didn't add the exact wording, since "severely disrupted" isn't very useful wording. I just mentioned that parts of the subway were closed by the floods, and put it in the final paragraph next to the Pennsylvania floods. ♫ Hurricanehink (talk) 19:31, 27 November 2025 (UTC)
Semi-protected edit request on 3 January 2026
| This edit request has been answered. Set the |answered= parameter to no to reactivate your request. |
Please add that Etna, PA was evacuated before the hurricane. Source : https://www.middletownpress.com/news/article/Ivan-to-dump-four-inches-of-rain-on-state-11926783.php ~2026-54508 (talk) 16:44, 3 January 2026 (UTC)
- The entire city was not evacuated, per the source. You also didn't indicate where in the article you wanted this, the preparations or impacts, or how to integrate it into the prose. ♫ Hurricanehink (talk) 16:47, 3 January 2026 (UTC)
- Not done: per the above response. Day Creature (talk) 16:53, 3 January 2026 (UTC)
- Ok how about this…At the end of the preparations, add
The western half of Etna, Pennsylvania was evacuated due to forecast flooding from Ivan on the Allgheny River,
using the source above.~2026-58571 (talk) 20:00, 3 January 2026 (UTC)
- Ok how about this…At the end of the preparations, add
I didn't think that Etna would be the only place evacuated, so I expanded the Pennsylvania section with multiple evacuations in the state, plus the buildings damaged statewide. ♫ Hurricanehink (talk) 21:19, 6 January 2026 (UTC)
Combine Meteorological history of Hurricane Ivan and Hurricane Ivan tornado outbreak?
The following discussion is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.
The met history article is 2,100 words, while the tornado outbreak article is around 4,700 words. Even while keeping the tables, I think the tornado outbreak would fit naturally with the met history, especially since the tornado outbreak talks about the meteorological conditions leading to the record outbreak. I believe combining both of them would make it easier to eventually improve both to a future featured article, since some of the Hurricane Ivan met history literature is going to be about the tornado outbreak. ♫ Hurricanehink (talk) 19:51, 11 January 2026 (UTC)
- I am unsure about this merge. Hurricane Ivan tornado outbreak isn't entirely meteorological history, so merging it into Meteorological history of Hurricane Ivan would introduce content irrelevant to the article's topic. Hurricane Ivan#United States 2 would be more appropriate. FourNoddlers (talk) 00:10, 12 January 2026 (UTC)
- The outbreak talks a lot about the meteorological conditions across the United States. The Ivan article is already at 6,800 words and is only going to get longer, so merging to the main article wouldn't work, there are too many tornadoes to cover. ♫ Hurricanehink (talk) 18:20, 12 January 2026 (UTC)
- In that case, the article shouldn't be merged unless there's a plan for handling the tornado outbreak's impacts. FourNoddlers (talk) 01:21, 13 January 2026 (UTC)
- I meant merging the met history and the tornado outbreak together. ♫ Hurricanehink (talk) 19:15, 13 January 2026 (UTC)
- That's what I was talking about. FourNoddlers (talk) 23:37, 13 January 2026 (UTC)
- The merge would copy and paste the table into the MH article. ♫ Hurricanehink (talk) 02:09, 14 January 2026 (UTC)
- That's what I was talking about. FourNoddlers (talk) 23:37, 13 January 2026 (UTC)
- I meant merging the met history and the tornado outbreak together. ♫ Hurricanehink (talk) 19:15, 13 January 2026 (UTC)
- In that case, the article shouldn't be merged unless there's a plan for handling the tornado outbreak's impacts. FourNoddlers (talk) 01:21, 13 January 2026 (UTC)
- The outbreak talks a lot about the meteorological conditions across the United States. The Ivan article is already at 6,800 words and is only going to get longer, so merging to the main article wouldn't work, there are too many tornadoes to cover. ♫ Hurricanehink (talk) 18:20, 12 January 2026 (UTC)
- Strong oppose due to Ivan's tornado outbreak was a record-breaking outbreak that the number is too high (about 120-127 tornados counted). ~2025-43396-43 (talk) 06:06, 12 January 2026 (UTC)
- Ivan's met history is already full of records, so having a single place for all of them makes sense. ♫ Hurricanehink (talk) 18:20, 12 January 2026 (UTC)
- Uh... I still didn't sure about the merger, and I guess that Ivan's tornado outbreak was too noticeable... right? ~2025-43396-43 (talk) 05:09, 13 January 2026 (UTC)
- If you mean noticeable, like experts noticed it, yes, there were lots of studies, and literally the first hit was "Environmental ingredients for supercells and tornadoes within Hurricane Ivan". Environmental ingredients are also in the MH article. ♫ Hurricanehink (talk) 19:15, 13 January 2026 (UTC)
- Uh... I still didn't sure about the merger, and I guess that Ivan's tornado outbreak was too noticeable... right? ~2025-43396-43 (talk) 05:09, 13 January 2026 (UTC)
- Ivan's met history is already full of records, so having a single place for all of them makes sense. ♫ Hurricanehink (talk) 18:20, 12 January 2026 (UTC)
The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.
Semi-protected edit request on 30 January 2026
| This edit request has been answered. Set the |answered= parameter to no to reactivate your request. |
The sentence “After Ivan regenerated in the Gulf of Mexico, it caused further heavy rainfall up to 8 inches (200 mm) in areas of Louisiana and Texas.” is unsourced - please either find a source or add a citation needed tag to it. ~2026-67203-8 (talk) 20:53, 30 January 2026 (UTC)
Done Added a tag. Day Creature (talk) 21:08, 30 January 2026 (UTC)
