User talk:Ibadibam

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Welcome

Hello, Ibadibam, and welcome to Wiki . Thank you for your contributions. I hope you like the place and decide to stay. If you are stuck, and looking for help, please come to the Newcomers help page, where experienced Wikipedians can answer any queries you have! Or, you can just type {{helpme}} on your user page, and someone will show up shortly to answer your questions. Here are a few good links for newcomers:

I hope you enjoy editing here and being a Wikipedian! By the way, you can sign your name on Talk and vote pages using three tildes, like this: ~~~. Four tildes (~~~~) produces your name and the current date. If you have any questions, see the help pages, add a question to the village pump or ask me on my talk page. Again, welcome! Kukini 04:55, 10 April 2006 (UTC)

WP:CHICAGO survey

WP:CHICAGO

You have been marked as an inactive member of WP:CHICAGO since you have not updated your status at Wikipedia:WikiProject Chicago/members. If you consider yourself either an active or semi-active member of the project please correct your status. If you consider yourself a member you may want to get involved in the Wikipedia:Meetup/Chicago 3. Also, if you are a member, be advised that the project is now trying to keep all the project's WP:PR, WP:FAC, WP:FAR, WP:GAR, WP:GAC WP:FLC, WP:FLRC, WP:FTC, WP:FPOC, WP:FPC, and WP:AFD discussion pages in one location at the new Wikipedia:WikiProject Chicago/Review page. Please help add any discussion you are aware of at this location.--TonyTheTiger (t/c/bio/WP:CHICAGO/WP:LOTM) 16:52, 10 August 2008 (UTC)

Barbershop

Thanks for the positive remarks - I sing with West Towns! --DAW0001 (talk) 04:59, 9 November 2009 (UTC)

Thank you

for reverting "History of the world" from "BC" and "AD" back to "BCE" and "CE." I think the latter are more appropriate to our times and to the subject.

I did not feel, however, that I could afford to undertake the effort that you have invested. I'm deeply grateful. Nihil novi (talk) 08:00, 25 June 2012 (UTC)

Nie ma za co, Nn :) I also messaged the user who made the edits, but since he hasn't set up his page, it remains to be seen whether he notices. Ibadibam (talk) 17:10, 25 June 2012 (UTC)

Disambiguation link notification for April 18

Hi. Thank you for your recent edits. Wikipedia appreciates your help. We noticed though that when you edited Sandwich, you added a link pointing to the disambiguation page Grilled cheese (check to confirm | fix with Dab solver). Such links are almost always unintended, since a disambiguation page is merely a list of "Did you mean..." article titles. Read the FAQ • Join us at the DPL WikiProject.

It's OK to remove this message. Also, to stop receiving these messages, follow these opt-out instructions. Thanks, DPL bot (talk) 11:39, 18 April 2013 (UTC)

This appears to be a false positive. Checking it out. Ibadibam (talk) 21:48, 18 April 2013 (UTC)

Re: Pepsi edit war

I hate to be a complete jerk, but people going on about little things like this long after they've happened is a much bigger problem than the actual thing could ever be. There is no principle there.

The only thing I am or was angry about is that, and multiple editors treating me like a vandal because one did. I don't particularly care about the block, even though that's the one thing anyone would care about me caring about. See how stupid even that sounds?

Thanks for the input, by the way. Wish those other guys would approach the subject in a similar way, but it doesn't look like that's going to happen. Despatche (talk) 06:09, 16 May 2013 (UTC)

WP:FOOD Needs You!

Hi there Ibadibam! I've noticed you have yourself listed as a member of the Food and Drink Wikiproject. Unfortunately it looks like the project has been slowly sliding into inactivity except for a couple of people. That makes me a sad potato, and nobody likes a sad potato amirite?

If you'd like to turn my frown upside down, can you do two small things?

First off, go here and add {{Tick}} (Y) next to your name if you're still part of the project.

Second, go to the project talkpage and participate in a discussion about how to make the project more active, and how to go about making articles in our area of interest a lot better.

You don't want to make me cry, do you? Potatoes have a lot of eyes you know. So come on, join in! :)

— The Potato Hose 18:33, 25 May 2013 (UTC)

Romanizations

Thanks for the link at Despatche's talk page! I always forget where that guideline is. :)--Atlan (talk) 20:22, 30 May 2013 (UTC)

Glad it helped

Ibadibam (talk) 20:25, 30 May 2013 (UTC)

Thanks

Thanks for the information about The Country Bears mistake. I see that although the edit was wrong, it was not meant to be vandalism. I admit that after doing vandalism reversion for several months with only a few very minor problems that were promptly taken care of, I have been mistaken, more like being fooled actually, three times recently. It is good to be reminded that something that may look like vandalism at first glance, and in fact may have been vandalism in another case, may just be wrong or unintentionally disruptive. I have seen a few such instances recently and adjusted my notice accordingly. In this case, I missed it. Donner60 (talk) 03:39, 1 June 2013 (UTC)

June 2013

Refrain from using automated warnings on good faith editors and their edits. It is extremely poor form. Thank you. OmniArticleEditor (talk) 16:52, 4 June 2013 (UTC)

Okay, okay, I'm sorry for WP:DTRing you. Please also assume that the warning was in good faith (I will point out that I used a GF-level template). I also noted that your account has been active for less than two weeks, and I assumed you're still finding your way around wiki policy. I'm just trying to help you be a better editor. Ibadibam (talk) 17:12, 4 June 2013 (UTC)

In that case then kindly remove your disrespectful template warning from my talk page. OmniArticleEditor (talk) 17:45, 4 June 2013 (UTC)

You're welcome to maintain your user talk page per the relevant guidelines. But please see the essay I linked to above, which encourages you to "take the template as a reminder and/or constructive criticism and move on." Ibadibam (talk) 17:59, 4 June 2013 (UTC)

Despite WP:AGF your warning comes across as unnecessarily robotically negative. Do avoid usage of templates in the future with registered users. Particularly ones that have even relatively minor histories of good faith editing. The project is losing editors left and right and such idiotic usage of templates is not going to help with that issue. OmniArticleEditor (talk) 18:07, 4 June 2013 (UTC)

Thanks, again

Thanks for watching out for my user page. I have had enough experience to expect some vandalism occasionally but it is always appreciated when a fellow editor promptly takes care of it. I have never seen someone (a vandal) put a bogus commendation on their talk page. It is even stranger since the previous vandalism was over a month ago. Too bad the person does not use his or her time and talent more productively. Thanks again. Donner60 (talk) 23:14, 7 June 2013 (UTC)

That's an awesome attitude to take! I've got to remember that: instead of "I wish this person weren't on Wikipedia," say, "I wish this person were doing something better with their life and fulfilling their great potential as a human being." Anyway, yeah, I was still watching your page from our last conversation. This definitely is a more creative vandal than I've seen before. So how was your monkey hunt?

Ibadibam (talk) 23:28, 7 June 2013 (UTC)

I did not catch any but they are rather fast. Donner60 (talk) 23:31, 7 June 2013 (UTC)

Grammar

You are incorrect with regard to immigrate and emigrate. The "point of view from which they are used" is entirely subjective. The fact remains that one immigrates to a country in which they have emigrated from. Immigrate to; emigrate from. Always.

I will not attempt to revert your reversions, as a quick Google search shows hundreds of mistakes on this site. It seems the vast majority, you included, are misinformed. My effort would be in vain if I had to deal with people like you for every correction I make.

Thank you for your time. — Preceding unsigned comment added by ImmigrateEmigrate (talk • contribs) 20:53, 8 August 2013‎

Thanks for your message. Did you get a chance to read the articles I posted on your talk page? That should provide some clarification. (If you have some authoritative sources for the rule you're using, I'd be interested to read them. I've really never heard of it until now.)

Immigration is the act of arriving, while emigration is the act of leaving. In general, "immigrate" is analogous to "come" and "emigrate" is analogous to "go," in the sense that one may "come from" or "come to" and "go from" or "go to." The construction used depends on the speaker's perspective. I'm in the United States, so if I'm talking about an American originally from Mongolia I would say they immigrated from Mongolia to the U.S. Someone in Mongolia would say that person emigrated to the U.S. from Mongolia. Both verbs have sufficient valency to allow both prepositional phrases specifying destination and origin.

It also makes more sense in cases like "Most Soviets allowed to leave during this time period were ethnic Jews permitted to emigrate to Israel [...]". The Soviet Union had no influence on immigration to Israel — they couldn't control who entered another country — but they did control emigration from the USSR, including emigration from the USSR to Israel. Ibadibam (talk) 21:19, 8 August 2013 (UTC)

"The Accidents of Style: Good Advice on How Not to Write Badly"

By Charles Harrington Elster

http://books.google.com/books?id=FgKFrucChzMC&lpg=PA175&ots=hGT3Y-weD0&pg=PA175#v=onepage&q&f=false ImmigrateEmigrate (talk) 22:12, 8 August 2013 (UTC)

Interesting. That seems like a good rule of thumb, but if you look at the first link I sent you it presents an exception to the rule: "The Polenskis do not live here any more. They emigrated to Canada in 1943." From the speaker's perspective, the Polenskis are emigrants. In Canada, they would be called immigrants. It works like "here" and "there" or "come" and "go." Ibadibam (talk) 22:57, 8 August 2013 (UTC)

All that to say, it seems like there are multiple valid conventions as to the usage of these words, and it might be worth getting a new Manual of Style guideline in place for consistency's sake. Incidentally, the question was raised some time ago at the Wikipedia reference desk without much consensus. The end suggestion was to simply change "immigrated" or "emigrated" to "moved" when the choice is not clear. Ibadibam (talk) 23:07, 8 August 2013 (UTC)

Your first link is editable content though. You wouldn't cite Wikipedia for anything would you? If there is to be any consistency, then the convention used should be based on the article's neutral perspective of the event(s). If it's a quote, then fine, but for everything else, it should be as I've described. ImmigrateEmigrate (talk) 00:35, 9 August 2013 (UTC)

I guess you're right that that first link isn't particularly reliable. It is a good indication that the usage of these verbs is not universal, though, and that a hard and fast rule based on prepositions isn't applicable in all cases. Different readers are going to understand the terms differently, and we want to be sensitive to that. Even Elster, in the book you linked to, uses "emigrate ... to" in the sentence, "An emigrant is a person who emigrates from his native country to another country [...]." What are your impressions of the reference desk thread I linked to? Ibadibam (talk) 00:46, 9 August 2013 (UTC)

You've misinterpreted Elster's quote. He has it, "emigrates from X ... to Y". X = "his native country", Y = "another country". What I've been claiming has been consistent with what he's written.

As far as the discussion you linked, they seem to be squabbling over the point of view. All of that can easily be resolved by using the (hopefully) neutral point of view of the article. In that case it should consistently be emigrate from; immigrate to. ImmigrateEmigrate (talk) 01:04, 9 August 2013 (UTC)

Of course X is the place of origin and Y is the destination. That's what "from" and "to" mean, naturally! The point is that you can see him using the verb "emigrate" with the preposition "to," indicating that "emigrate to" is a perfectly acceptable construction, even for him. You could rearrange the sentence and the meaning wouldn't change. Tell me you don't think the following four phrases aren't identical in meaning:

"A person who emigrates from his native country to another country."
"A person who emigrates to another country from his native country."
"A person who immigrates from his native country to another country."
"A person who immigrates to another country from his native country."

I misspoke when I used the term "point of view" as I didn't mean to suggest an article shouldn't be neutral. I really meant the grammatical point of view — the context of the sentence. The same thing that tells you when to use "this" or "that," "here" or "there," and so forth. Ibadibam (talk) 01:32, 9 August 2013 (UTC)

There's not one instance in that book in which "emigrate" is immediately followed by the preposition "to". This is the crux of the issue. It explicitly states that "[e]migrate is followed by the preposition 'from'." And that's exactly how you've quoted it. The "to" comes after the "emigrate from" pair. It's not the associative preposition for emigrate. Conversely, the same applies to an "immigrate to" pair being followed by "from."

The only acceptable sentences you've quoted are the first and fourth. Although the other two may sound fine, they are semantically incorrect. ImmigrateEmigrate (talk) 02:16, 9 August 2013 (UTC)

What is the meaning of the second and third, if different from the first and fourth? And since when does the order of prepositional phrases alter the meaning of a clause? Ibadibam (talk) 02:43, 9 August 2013 (UTC)

The meaning is irrelevant. I can interpret what you mean because of the context of our discussion, and I can interpret it into something entirely different, but that's not the point. The point is that it is not grammatically correct for "to" to follow "emigrate" or "from" to follow "immigrate".

I don't want to flood you with book citations, so I'm going to flood you with book citations.

The Careful Writer By Theodore M. Bernstein

Kaplan SAT Strategies for Super Busy Students 2009 Edition: 10 Simple Steps ... By Kaplan

Garner's Modern American Usage By Bryan A. Garner

Robert Hartwell Fiske's Dictionary of Unendurable English: A Compendium of ... By Robert Hartwell Fiske

Got Grammar Ready-to-Use Lessons and Activities That Make Grammar Fun! By Jack Umstatter

I'm not discussing this anymore. You're free to believe what you want. Have a good day. ImmigrateEmigrate (talk) 03:57, 9 August 2013 (UTC)

Oh no! Please don't get discouraged. I really don't mean to put you off! I'm finding the discussion quite stimulating. Remember that our goal here isn't to establish some universal linguistic truth, nor is it to win an argument, but to arrive at a mutual understanding and consensus about the most effective way of conveying information to Wikipedia's readers. My hope is that our conversation can be synthesized into a proposal for a new usage guideline that will help other Wikipedia editors make smart choices.

If you feel that the discussion is getting a bit heated, then I understand if you'd like to take a break, but I hope you'll find it in you to continue this productive inquiry into what seems to be a pretty important style point.

Thanks for this excellent survey of style guides. They present a useful array of opinions on the question. Bernstein is clearly in the same camp as Elster: the verbs are each meant to subcategorize for a particular preposition. The Kaplan guide is more moderate but vaguely so, indicating that the subcategorization is not universal, but "usual." Garner is at the other end, saying that the verbs are interchangeable in certain circumstances, when the preposition used is sufficiently precise. Fiske and Umstatter appear to agree with Bernstein, though they don't explicitly state whether the subcategorization is universal or case-specific.

I still don't understand the basis for your point about Elster's example. I'm unaware of a constraint on the order of prepositional phrases in the English language. In Elster's sentence, both prepositional phrases are adjuncts of the verb, each fulfilling a complementary semantic role: one is the origin, the other the destination. From a syntactic and semantic perspective, both phrases have equivalent weight.

When you wrote, "I can interpret what you mean because of the context of our discussion, and I can interpret it into something entirely different," what would be the "entirely different" interpretation?

Associative prepositions are things like "in" in the sentence "I believe in Santa Claus." The presence or absence of the preposition alters the meaning of the verb. I see no indication that "emigrate" and "immigrate" are prepositional verbs. Indeed, they can be used with no preposition at all, as in, "There were few jobs available, so the family decided to emigrate."

I'm inclined to see the rules advanced by Elster, Bernstein, Fiske and Umstatter as general guidelines, rather than universally applied rules. That is to say, if one is unsure which verb to use, chances are good that, if one is using the preposition "to," then the focus is on the act of arrival, thus "immigrate" is more likely to be correct. Conversely, if one is using the preposition "from" then it's likely the sentence is focused on the act of departure and "emigrate" is likely to be correct. This is a simpler rule to understand than explaining the full semantics of the verbs, and thus more concise in a style guide that's meant to be a quick reference. In the same vein, "I before E, except after C" is still taught in schools because it's correct most of the time, despite there being numerous exceptions.

This interpretation seems to fit better with the historical usage of the terms, which doesn't appear to follow the rule just so. To interpret the rule at face value is artificially prescriptive, and has little basis in the English language as it actually exists. Ibadibam (talk) 20:02, 9 August 2013 (UTC)

"Be nice"

Just a comment, I believe my comments were far more civil and useful than anything he's ever said. Either way, I'm not assuming good faith for someone who says "I don't care about Wikipedia's silly policy" and is deliberately petulant. Believe me, I've tried to AGF but the guy is a child, whether or not he's an IP, and should not be taken lightly. Note taken, either way. --ThomasO1989 (talk) 22:46, 26 August 2013 (UTC)

Sounds really unpleasant! I had to revert one of his edits myself. Some people just think they know everything and can't accept that Wikipedia is as much as social exercise as it is an encyclopedia, if not more. Hope the future is brighter

Ibadibam (talk) 00:02, 27 August 2013 (UTC)

A cup of tea for you!

Thank you for the diplomatically put reminder. 7&6=thirteen (☎) 15:44, 27 August 2013 (UTC)

WP:Food

It would be appreciated if you joined in the conversation occurring at WT:Food regarding the layout and presentation of the project's main page. Northamerica1000^(talk) 03:20, 4 September 2013 (UTC)

Egyptian Turks

this article has information about Egyptian Turks history and demographics but Turks in Egypt has a no formation about history nor demographics and this sentence (Turks in Egypt) talked about the Egyptian Turks as ethnic group in Egyptian society so I refused to merge my article with (Turks in Egypt) — Preceding unsigned comment added by Turkmen oglu (talk • contribs) 23:57, 17 September 2013 (UTC)

It's far, far better to improve the existing article than create a new one about the same subject. Please leave the pages as they are, with templates in place, and participate in the discussion at Turks in Egypt#Proposed merge with Egyptian Turks. Ibadibam (talk) 18:07, 18 September 2013 (UTC)

Performance

I am well aware of the express scope of WP:OC#PERF. HOwever, the principle needs to be applied also byu analogy to other situations. Two that are currently coming up regularly on WP:CFD are:

Places located on named long-distance paths
Chemical compounds that occur in particular species, some being extremely ubiquitous.

These category types raise exactly the same problems as the classic application of PERF. I will thereofre continue to cite it beyond its express scope. Peterkingiron (talk) 18:14, 28 September 2013 (UTC)

Wikiproject Food and Drink Newsletter - October 2013

More information Food and drink articles by quality and importance, Quality ...

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Lorem ipsum dolor sit amet, consectetur adipiscing elit, sed do eiusmod tempor incididunt ut labore et dolore magna aliqua. Ut enim ad minim veniam, quis nostrud exercitation ullamco laboris nisi ut aliquip ex ea commodo consequat. Duis aute irure dolor in reprehenderit in voluptate velit esse cillum dolore eu fugiat nulla pariatur. Excepteur sint occaecat cupidatat non proident, sunt in culpa qui officia deserunt mollit anim id est laborum.

Curabitur pretium tincidunt lacus. Nulla gravida orci a odio. Nullam varius, turpis et commodo pharetra, est eros bibendum elit, nec luctus magna felis sollicitudin mauris. Integer in mauris eu nibh euismod gravida. Duis ac tellus et risus vulputate vehicula. Donec lobortis risus a elit. Etiam tempor. Ut ullamcorper, ligula eu tempor congue, eros est euismod turpis, id tincidunt sapien risus a quam. Maecenas fermentum consequat mi. Donec fermentum. Pellentesque malesuada nulla a mi. Duis sapien sem, aliquet nec, commodo eget, consequat quis, neque. Aliquam faucibus, elit ut dictum aliquet, felis nisl adipiscing sapien, sed malesuada diam lacus eget erat. Cras mollis scelerisque nunc. Nullam arcu. Aliquam consequat. Curabitur augue lorem, dapibus quis, laoreet et, pretium ac, nisi. Aenean magna nisl, mollis quis, molestie eu, feugiat in, orci. In hac habitasse platea dictumst.

Fusce convallis, mauris imperdiet gravida bibendum, nisl turpis suscipit mauris, sed placerat ipsum urna sed risus. In convallis tellus a mauris. Curabitur non elit ut libero tristique sodales. Mauris a lacus. Donec mattis semper leo. In hac habitasse platea dictumst. Vivamus facilisis diam at odio. Mauris dictum, nisi eget consequat elementum, lacus ligula molestie metus, non feugiat orci magna ac sem. Donec turpis. Donec vitae metus. Morbi tristique neque eu mauris. Quisque gravida ipsum non sapien. Proin turpis lacus, scelerisque vitae, elementum at, lobortis ac, quam. Aliquam dictum eleifend risus. In hac habitasse platea dictumst. Etiam sit amet diam. Suspendisse odio. Suspendisse nunc. In semper bibendum libero.

Proin nonummy, lacus eget pulvinar lacinia, pede felis dignissim leo, vitae tristique magna lacus sit amet eros. Nullam ornare. Praesent odio ligula, dapibus sed, tincidunt eget, dictum ac, nibh. Nam quis lacus. Nunc eleifend molestie velit. Morbi lobortis quam eu velit. Donec euismod vestibulum massa. Donec non lectus. Aliquam commodo lacus sit amet nulla. Cras dignissim elit et augue. Nullam non diam. Pellentesque habitant morbi tristique senectus et netus et malesuada fames ac turpis egestas. In hac habitasse platea dictumst. Aenean vestibulum. Sed lobortis elit quis lectus. Nunc sed lacus at augue bibendum dapibus.

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Article statistics

Food and Drink WikiProject
article assessment

Food and drink articles by quality and importance
Quality	Importance
Quality	Top	High	Mid	Low	NA	???	Total
FA		8	18	37			63
FL		2		15			17
FM					158		158
GA	24	42	100	348		2	516
B	53	235	366	863		110	1,627
C	70	427	1,082	4,136		689	6,404
Start	25	305	1,699	13,495		4,508	20,032
Stub		15	491	9,137		5,212	14,855
List	12	73	117	581	22	288	1,093
Category					10,302		10,302
Disambig					229		229
File					5,002		5,002
Portal					809		809
Project					445		445
Redirect	2	12	82	739	3,084		3,919
Template					1,097		1,097
NA					8		8
Other				8	285		293
Assessed	186	1,119	3,955	29,359	21,441	10,809	66,869
Unassessed				6		1,012	1,018
Total	186	1,119	3,955	29,365	21,441	11,821	67,887
WikiWork factors (?)		ω = 220,819			Ω = 5.08

Close

Delivered by Northamerica1000^(talk) 20:48, 3 October 2013 (UTC)

NPOV and sandwiches

Actually a lot of the UK sandwiches are almost by inclusion NPOV: baked bean sanwiches (neither notable nor edible), crisp sandwich (forsooth) &c. Its understandable I'm a London-born European of UK descent (I'll go a long way to deny being British) and know that the country has a deeply dysfunctional attitude towards food. We used to eat anything, provided it was disgusting in some way, & have now swung to the opposite extreme. I.e we'll eat anything provided its garnished with the right adjectives. Still have not got the idea.TheLongTone (talk) 05:30, 5 November 2013 (UTC)

A cup of tea for you!

To relax with after adding citation templates to Fiasco (role-playing game) Neonchameleon (talk) 11:54, 7 January 2014 (UTC)

Hello, Ibadibam. You have new messages at CraneInHand's talk page.
You can remove this notice at any time by removing the {{Talkback}} or {{Tb}} template.

Posted some suggestions for edits on "Sherd" in the sherd talk section.

Hello, Ibadibam. You have new messages at CraneInHand's talk page.
You can remove this notice at any time by removing the {{Talkback}} or {{Tb}} template.

I posted some suggestions in the "sherd" talk section. Can't figure out if there is a way to have this message direct you there rather than to my talk page. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 150.135.211.246 (talk) 17:43, 26 February 2014‎

A Dobos torte for you!

7&6=thirteen (☎) has given you a Dobos Torte to enjoy! Seven layers of fun because you deserve it.

To give a Dobos Torte and spread the WikiLove, just place {{subst:Dobos Torte}} on someone else's talkpage, whether it be someone you have had disagreements with in the past or a good friend.

7&6=thirteen (☎) 13:29, 15 March 2014 (UTC)

Move discussion

See Talk:Livery Company#Requested move to Livery company. Thank you, EdJohnston (talk) 23:38, 18 March 2014 (UTC)

Yeah, thanks. I wasn't 100% sure it was noncontroversial which is why I went through TPM. Thanks for the sanity check. Ibadibam (talk) 23:51, 18 March 2014 (UTC)

Disambiguation link notification for March 22

Hi. Thank you for your recent edits. Wikipedia appreciates your help. We noticed though that when you edited List of places with "Silicon" names, you added a link pointing to the disambiguation page Russian Silicon Valley (check to confirm | fix with Dab solver). Such links are almost always unintended, since a disambiguation page is merely a list of "Did you mean..." article titles. Read the FAQ • Join us at the DPL WikiProject.

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Link was intentional, but may not be necessary. Ibadibam (talk) 17:43, 25 March 2014 (UTC)

Al fresco

See WP:NOTDIC. If you're unsure of why someone has done something, or disagree, best approach is to leave them a note rather than following behind reverting. If after reading WP:NOTDIC you still feel the topic has merit as an article, then we can open this up for wider discussion at WP:AfD. SilkTork ^{✔Tea time} 15:22, 8 May 2014 (UTC)

See WP:BRD. I respect your frustration—it's annoying to have contributions reverted, especially a kneejerk revert like the one I just made, but I'd appreciate a good-faith effort to build consensus for this change, since it is roughly equivalent to deletion. Ibadibam (talk) 15:28, 8 May 2014 (UTC)

Seattle

Thanks for the information. I didn't know about the newsblog exception. Question though, should that be reworded slightly, since the information is from last year? Onel5969 (talk) 00:39, 28 May 2014 (UTC)
- That sounds prudent. The IP who made the initial change was a bit heavy handed. Ibadibam (talk) 01:21, 28 May 2014 (UTC)

Email

Hi. Is there any reason you have inactive WP:EMAIL? I wanted to send you some information that I don't feel confident disclosing in public. --_{Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus| reply here} 02:45, 3 June 2014 (UTC)

No reason. Enabled now. Ibadibam (talk) 03:34, 3 June 2014 (UTC)

Manwich

Hi, you reverted Manwich to a broken version. I agree the ", Inc" is unnecessary, but my main reason for editing was to delete the ".". Buster79 (talk) 20:51, 5 June 2014 (UTC)

You're right. I missed the period. Probably the best thing to do would have been to just delete the period. Less heavy-handed that way. I've gone ahead and done so. Ibadibam (talk) 20:56, 5 June 2014 (UTC)

Ouch! Thanks, and apologies. Buster79 (talk) 19:54, 25 June 2014 (UTC)

Re minor edit. Trackless/trolleybus

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Anmccaff (talk) 01:37, 6 June 2014 (UTC)

About semiotics

Hi Ibadibam. Thanks for asking about "Semiotics of X". I have been seeing a series of semiotics-related articles, placing the template {{Semiotics-stub}} where applicable, and now there is a Category:Semiotics stubs as well. The articles without the sorting key seem to look easier to find on the category - just try and take a look. And, if my edition was inappropriate, please excuse me and feel free to revert it, if it's better that way out. Regards, --Fadesga (talk) 01:35, 10 June 2014 (UTC)

June 2014

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References

Eden Foods

Moved to Talk:Eden Foods Inc. § Infant recovery

list of breads

I've asked for semi-protection at WP:RPP. You might wish to comment. Dougweller (talk) 09:32, 7 August 2014 (UTC)

Union Jack and flag codes

Moved to Talk:Union Jack § Union Jack and flag codes

Template:Lang-x

Thank you for fixing my mistake on Template:Lang-x. I do not want to mess things up!!

Latest revision as of 18:58, 12 August 2014 (edit) (undo) (thanked)

Ibadibam (talk | contribs)

(Reverted good faith edits by Thnidu (talk): This page is transcluded for multiple languages. (TW))

— Preceding unsigned comment added by Thnidu (talk • contribs) 18:28, 13 August 2014

Ibadibam (talk) 18:44, 13 August 2014 (UTC)

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Merge discussion for Hot Chicken sandwich

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Mister Saturday Night

Hey There, I wrote an article about Mister Saturday Night a famous party and record label in NYC. Why would it be deleted? Are there changes I can make? — Preceding unsigned comment added by Tjryan44 (talk • contribs) 15:39, 22 October 2014 (UTC)

Hi, Tjryan44! You can read the rationale and contribute to the discussion at Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Mister Saturday Night. The basis for the nomination is that the article doesn't cite sources that are considered reliable under Wikipedia standards. I searched the web for more substantial coverage, but couldn't find any, so I couldn't determine that the topic meets Wikipedia's general notability guidelines. If you look at the discussion, however, you'll see that another editor, Northamerica1000, had better luck than I did finding sources, and linked to a few. The best thing to do now is to incorporate these sources into the article using citations, and demonstrating that this subject meets at least one of the notability criteria outlined in the WP:MUSBIO or WP:EVENTCRIT guidelines. Ibadibam (talk) 19:22, 22 October 2014 (UTC)

My apologies for misattribution in the "trolleybus" article

...and my thanks for correcting it. Sorry. I started to copy one thing, moved on to another, and seem to have dropped someting where it didn't belong. ANMcC — Preceding unsigned comment added by Anmccaff (talk • contribs) 19:30, 6 January 2015 (UTC)

Yeah, splitting comments is always tricky. I usually just add mine below the whole, long comment so as to avoid confusion on my part or that of the reader. Ibadibam (talk) 19:37, 6 January 2015 (UTC)

Precious

"Hope the future is brighter"
Thank you, veteran editor, for gnomish improvements, for comments on article alerts, for restoring information, adding navboxes and removing unrelated ones, for welcoming new users and "Hope the future is brighter"- you are an awesome Wikipedian!

--Gerda Arendt (talk) 13:10, 5 February 2015 (UTC)

A year ago, you were recipient no. 1114 of Precious, a prize of QAI! --Gerda Arendt (talk) 08:27, 5 February 2016 (UTC)

Two years now! --Gerda Arendt (talk) 07:54, 5 February 2017 (UTC)

Yay! Ibadibam (talk) 06:29, 6 February 2017 (UTC)

Four years ;) --Gerda Arendt (talk) 09:50, 5 February 2019 (UTC)

Does the span between anniversary messages double each time?

Ibadibam (talk) 18:05, 5 February 2019 (UTC)

no, five ;) --Gerda Arendt (talk) 06:54, 5 February 2020 (UTC)

I am bejeweled and bedazzled. Ibadibam (talk) 19:28, 5 February 2020 (UTC)

flag capitalisation

I'd like to note that while a flag may have a proper name, i.e. National Flag of Canada, terms like "Canadian flag" are generic Primergrey (talk) 09:03, 18 March 2015 (UTC)

That's a good point. Ibadibam (talk) 17:30, 18 March 2015 (UTC)

Penderyn (whisky)

Hi, I removed a reference to Nigel Short as it is not accurate or supported with any evidence; nor is it relevant to the company in which the Wiki is about, nor its products.

I hope this makes sense. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 193.203.71.210 (talk) 07:26, 23 April 2015 (UTC)

Howard Johnson's

Moved to Talk:Howard Johnson's § Blazing Saddles

Untitled

Hi Ibadibam. I am really happy that you have reached out to me. Thanks for your patience. I am super busy right now. I do plan to study the documents you have sent me and improve my ability to contribute to Wikipedia. If you have any specific recommendations or suggestions for me to improve my writing, or just any questions in general, please feel free to contact me in this way. I hope that's OK for the time being. I definitely would like to create an account in time. I tend to focus on inputting information and subsequenty, within a day or two, integrate it into the rest of the article by improving the grammar and flow. Thanks, 70.53.215.121 (talk) 03:03, 30 May 2015 (UTC)

Arcadia

Bonjour, I am French and are not easy in English. I will place at the end of the article the external link, please accept my thanks for improving my writings, PF pfpuech@yahoo.fr — Preceding unsigned comment added by PUECH P.-F. (talk • contribs) 04:21, 16 June 2015 (UTC)

Tunisian Arabic

Dear User,

As you are one of the contributors to Tunisian Arabic. You are kindly asked to review the part about Domains of Use and adjust it directly or through comments in the talk page of Tunisian Arabic.

Yours Sincerely,

--Csisc (talk) 13:46, 30 June 2015 (UTC)

I thank you for your edit in Wikipedia. I will try to do a part about Scripts, History and Research in Tunisian Arabic as soon as possible. I will inform you of any update when available so that you can review it immediately. --Csisc (talk) 12:04, 4 July 2015 (UTC)

Meetup to revitalize & prioritize WikiProject Seattle

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Berlin

Howdy. I hope you like the sortable list that you suggested. Incidentally, there's already an incomplete list tag way at the top of the article. Cheers.Anythingyouwant (talk) 22:16, 30 July 2015 (UTC)

PS, I just removed the one at the top.Anythingyouwant (talk) 22:18, 30 July 2015 (UTC)

Thanks. I didn't notice it because it was at the top. Usually those templates go right before the list itself. Thanks for your hard work on the list. It's a much better page now! Ibadibam (talk) 22:20, 30 July 2015 (UTC)

One of WikiProject Food and Drink's articles has been selected for improvement!

Hello,
Please note that Berry, which is within WikiProject Food and Drink's scope, has been selected as one of Today's articles for improvement. The article was scheduled to appear on Wikipedia's Community portal in the "Today's articles for improvement" section for one week, beginning today. Everyone is encouraged to collaborate to improve the article. Thanks, and happy editing!

Bananasoldier (talk) 02:24, 10 August 2015 (UTC)

Wikipedia Lab at the UW Research Commons

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Wikipedia email re Newspapers.com signup

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ArbCom elections are now open!

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Overquotation?

As marked here. Is this really an issue when the quoted content is public domain, and clearly solid? Where is there a policy or guideline against this? - Jmabel | Talk 05:23, 8 December 2015 (UTC)

Hi there, and thanks for contacting me! The relevant guideline is at WP:QUOTEFARM. Here are some reasons I think this particular use of quotation is problematic:

Quotations are useful when...
- the original text is clearer and more succinct than a paraphrase would be
- the original phrase is noteworthy ("Hamlet says, 'Too be or not to be'" is much better than "Hamlet states that the issue in question is between being and the absence thereof.")
- the material is controversial and/or prone to misinterpretation, and thus better to let the original speak for itself
Having the body of the article be an excerpt from a single source gives undue weight to that source and its perspective. A good article conveys diverse information from multiple sources. Granted, this particular source is fairly objective, but the point remains that Wikipedia is not a clearinghouse for public domain text; it's an encyclopedia with its own content.
While the text was published on a government website, it is not necessarily in the public domain (see Wikipedia:Public domain#U.S. government works). The disclaimer for this project states that the text is the authorship of the National Conference of State Historic Preservation Officers and the National Council of Preservation Educators, neither of which are government organizations and thus not subject to automatic release of copyright. Long quotations exceed the bounds of fair use and thus open up Wikipedia to copyright infringement claims.

Ideally, we'll be able to convert this passage to paraphrase and intermix it with information from other sources. Ibadibam (talk) 01:47, 9 December 2015 (UTC)

Thanks, that's very clear. In particular, I had no idea that wasn't PD. - Jmabel | Talk 18:49, 9 December 2015 (UTC)

The term "ancohemitonic"

Hi there,

I was wondering if you could help me, as I see you've contributed to this article.

I'm submitting a research proposal for a PhD scholarship, and its basically a compositional study of all 42 of the seven-note modes (excluding ones with consecutive semitones), as they are seen in the table on the "anhemitonic scale" page.

These scales are described as "ancohemitonic". I was wondering - do you know whose labelling this is? I can't find this term mentioned anywhere else on the internet.

If this is the widely accepted term for these types of scale, then it would be very helpful to me, as I can refer to the scales I wish to study in my PhD as heptatonic "ancohemitonic" modes.

Many thanks for your help,

Tom

--82.37.39.47 (talk) 02:04, 28 December 2015 (UTC)

Hello Tom! I'm not familiar with those terms, nor have I contributed to that article (apart from some superficial copyediting). I'd start with the article's list of references, particularly the notes for the passages wherein the terms are introduced: Christ (1966), Tymoczko (1997) and Keith (1991).

Please let me know what you find. It's important we verify those sources to ensure they actually support the article's content, something that can be difficult for those of us without access to academic databases. Ibadibam (talk) 14:30, 28 December 2015 (UTC)

Micklam railway station

Thank you for your suggestion.

Why might it be better?

I have adopted the practice of accumulating "Further Reading" lists to give readers a bibliography around a line or a railway and the stations on it. I've done the same throughout the CWJR and WCER and the Immingham area and you are the first to ask the question.

When I cite sources they are specific to that article, but Further Reading is just that. I don't misuse it and include things with no relevance, but try to give the reader opportunities.

Thank you for your interest.

DaveDavidAHull (talk) 01:56, 1 March 2016 (UTC)

Thanks for writing, Dave. If readers want more information about the line or railway, I'd generally expect them to first visit the Wikipedia article on that line or railway, and thereby have access to the further reading list on that page, so it wouldn't be necessary to duplicate the list in all related pages. If the reader wants more information about the line, they'd consult the further reading list for the line article. For more on the station, they'd consult the list for the station article.

So in the case of the station itself, and really any page at all, I'd limit the list items to works that cover that topic in particular. While the relevant guideline (WP:FURTHER) only discusses "a reasonable number" of works, the essay Wikipedia:Further reading lays out a case for some limits on the length of the further reading appendix, namely that the works should be directly relevant to the article's specific topic, and consist only of enough works to give the reader an adequate survey of that topic, lest we make them pick through an abundance of tangentially related material to find the information they seek.

I would also add that, in the case of short articles, "further reading" works may be seen as potential sources for future expansion of the article, and thus the goal is to gradually reduce the length of the reading list and increase that of the references list.

In the case of Micklam railway station, the further reading list occupies about as much space as the article body itself, and looks like it contains works that are not so much about the station as they are about operations in the general region. It's not to say that it's doing any particular harm, but if I were doing research on the Micklam station, I'd appreciate the resource much more if the list had already filtered out the works that don't cover the station in detail. Ibadibam (talk) 02:27, 2 March 2016 (UTC)

Then I suggest you chuck away the lot, as Micklam is mentioned in several (eg on maps) but none of the Further Reading contains anything specific, or I would have included it in references. I must say it seems rum to prefer to face an interested reader with no potentially fruitful material rather than a list of tangentially fruitful material, but hey, I had fun finding the stuff, why deny others that pleasure? I've moved on to trying to do something else constructive now, so over to you: I find, you trash. Have fun. DaveDavidAHull (talk) 09:13, 2 March 2016 (UTC)

I'm not really comfortable making changes to the page, as I'm unfamiliar with the topic. I was only doing some page patrolling and this article was of sufficient quality that I had to stretch to find any room for improvement to include as feedback in the review. That feedback is offered in good faith, without any obligation to use it. I'm just going to leave a maintenance tag on the article and let you and other knowledgeable Wikipedians sort it out. Thanks for the correspondence, and happy editing! Ibadibam (talk) 01:39, 3 March 2016 (UTC)

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The Cleanup Barnstar

		The Cleanup Barnstar
		For tirelessly refining the gold from the junk across Wikipedia. Mr. Magoo (talk) 23:59, 22 March 2016 (UTC)

Wow, my first-ever barnstar. That's really nice of you, Magoo! Ibadibam (talk) 00:03, 23 March 2016 (UTC)

March 2016

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Many tildes Reply

Hello, Ibadibam. You have new messages at Gil Dawson's talk page.
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your revert on list of softdrink flavors

is interesting. one click for the revert - adequate effort, I'd say. But then this immaculate long sentence in the justification. It would have taken you the same amount of time and reasoning to just remedy the situation. Instead: back to the baseline. I don't get it. -- Kku 07:20, 27 April 2016 (UTC)

Thanks for getting in touch! I didn't revise the paragraph because I don't think it's in any urgent need of revision. Otherwise, yes, you're absolutely right that it would have been lazy of me to simply revert. Ibadibam (talk) 14:38, 27 April 2016 (UTC)

Union Jack and Winston Churchill

You say that the Churchill quote is already in the article under Popular Culture but only because you moved it there! The quote was not in the article until I introduced it. This is an important quote as it shows that a very significant person such as Churchill used the term Union Jack and did NOT use the name Union Flag. He was not only the Prime Minister of the UK twice but also he served as First Lord of the Admiralty. Seeing as there are some very determined people who seem to want to relegate the name Union Jack to slang trying to dominate this page I believe that this quotation should be in the section about correct terminology. And you added that he used the term in a 'derisively' way which is not the case at all - that is NOT supported by the source material that I utilized and is pure opinion. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Platinumpaintitblack (talk • contribs) 21:08, 16 August 2016 (UTC)

@Platinumpaintitblack: You made this comment six minutes after I had removed the offending phrase. Perhaps our edits crossed? Ibadibam (talk) 21:19, 16 August 2016 (UTC)

Hi Ibadidam. I'm not posting on the UJ page for at least another day to avoid 3RR or edit warring accusations (actually I only 1RR'ed but that can be sufficient) however as a more temperate editor you might care to cast an eye over this for debunking of the "modern" comment. May I also draw your attention to (1) this was a private informal letter from a young man to his mum and (2) "the Union Jack & the Star Spangled Banner" - is Platinumpaintblack now going to argue that the name of the US flag is also to be changed? On another point, other than going to ANI, could you suggest an alternative warning other than uw-vandalism3? Lesser warnings say that the changes will be reverted, but I didn't want to revert due to the risk of 3RR/1RR. Regards, Martin of Sheffield (talk) 22:31, 16 August 2016 (UTC)

I've responded at the discussion you linked in your comment. For warning procedure, see my response in the section below. I would like to avoid ANI if at all possible. Ibadibam (talk) 20:04, 17 August 2016 (UTC)

Dear Ibadibam I originally inserted the Churchill quote as I believe that as possibly the most significant statesman in UK history (certainly one of) whether he routinely called the UK flag Union Jack or Union Flag is highly significant and should be in the 'Terminology' section of this page. I did not introduce this quote in order to discuss his mother's proposed magazine. If that had been my intention I would agree it would be more appropriate to the 'Popular Culture' section - but that was not my intention. Therefore I disagree with your relegation of an article that I (not anyone else) originally introduced into the Union Jack page. I am being accused by others of 'vandalism' and 'edit-warring' but it is not me aggressively deleting or moving another's entry - I am the victim here. I introduce a perfectly valid and relevant point - with associated link to prove provenance and confirm the credibility of the point I am making - and I find myself being edited left-right and centre! Why? Because those editing my point don't like the point I am making maybe? There can be no other reason as my point is correct, valid and proven with links. That type of editing is not in the spirit of Wikipedia! — Preceding unsigned comment added by Platinumpaintitblack (talk • contribs) 09:59, 17 August 2016 (UTC)

@Platinumpaintitblack: we're not out to get you. There is no conspiracy to suppress "Union Jack" and your edits are being reverted not because we don't like your opinion, but because the very content you are adding is not helpful to the article. Consider the following:

You continue to say that the Churchill paragraph should be in the "Terminology" section, but each time you add it there, you don't remove it from "In popular culture", so you are in effect creating duplicate content. In fact, in your most recent revert, you re-added language to which you'd previously objected.
You are attempting to use a primary source to support a conclusion which that source does not make. The Wikipedia community calls this original research, and it's expressly forbidden on this website.
After an editor has reverted one's changes, the best practice is to go to the talk page to discuss the issues raised by the reverter. Only when all parties have reached consensus should further action be taken in the article. By re-adding your content before we have concluded our discussion, you are circumventing the consensus-building process.

I have opened a discussion at Talk:Union Jack#Churchill on the flag. Please respond there, discussing only the quotation and the article—not questions of editing procedure—and desist from editing the article until we've sorted the matter out. If you would like to continue a separate discussion on procedure, we can do that here. Ibadibam (talk) 20:01, 17 August 2016 (UTC)

It seems to me that Wikipedia is there for everyone to edit - I quote the page in Wikipedia about Wikipedia: "Wikipedia is a free Internet encyclopedia that allows its users to edit almost any article accessible." ^[1]. You and ‘Martin of Sheffield’ appear to feel that you are 'super-editors' who can act as pseudo-official Wiki-personnel using pseudo-official language to enforce your own opinions and decisions on others. It is up to me what I insert and if I don't break the rules then my posts should stand. I will happily go to the real official Wiki-people for their adjudication. I have been accused of vandalism by ‘Martin of Sheffield’. I quote again the page on Wikipedia - "Any edit that changes content in a way that deliberately compromises the integrity of Wikipedia is considered vandalism. The most common and obvious types of vandalism include insertion of obscenities and crude humor. Vandalism can also include advertising language and other types of spam. Sometimes editors commit vandalism by removing information or entirely blanking a given page. Less common types of vandalism, such as the deliberate addition of plausible but false information to an article, can be more difficult to detect. Vandals can introduce irrelevant formatting, modify page semantics such as the page's title or categorization, manipulate the underlying code of an article, or use images disruptively." My insertion on Churchill's use of the term Union Jack does NOT break any of these rules. Indeed I would draw your attention out the part that states - "Sometimes editors commit vandalism by removing information" - so those deleting my own contributions (which do not themselves break the rules) are guilty of 'vandalism' according to this definition. I inserted some interesting and valid points. I accepted your suggestion (after you had deleted the contribution) that I quoted sources and I subsequently did so and re-posted the information. I have desisted from adding the point about the 'Union Jack Club' as I agree it is a more subtle point that some might not understand. But the Churchill quote I wish to have added to the site in the Terminology section, where I believe it belongs, alongside other points about the name of the flag. It has since been aggressively deleted, altered and moved. That is 'vandalism' according to the rules of Wikipedia. It is my contribution and I want it to go where I believe it is justified in going - and as I am not breaking the rules it should be left unadulterated by other editors who obviously have ulterior motives. I suggest that people editing and deleting my contribution simply don't agree with my point even though I back the points up with solid and credible support sources. So - report me to whoever you like. I will be happy to argue my case. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Platinumpaintitblack (talk • contribs) 22:01, 17 August 2016 (UTC)

@Platinumpaintitblack: Martin was wrong to place a boilerplate vandalism warning on your page. You didn't commit vandalism, because stubborness is not vandalism, even if it's not particularly constructive.

It's also worth nothing that no one else has committed vandalism here. If a user removes content without cause, that's vandalism, per Wikipedia:Vandalism#Blanking, illegitimate. When a user removes content with cause, that's not vandalism. I know you've been shown this link before, but the BOLD really does explain a lot about the working procedure most Wikipedia editors expect to be observed by our peers.

Again, you've not committed vandalism and I apologize for the improper warning placed on your talk page. I also think BilCat's revert of your edits was hasty. Martin actually tried to strike a compromise between you and BilCat after that, one which I tried to improve, however imperfectly. By rejecting this compromise without attempting discussion, although you didn't violate the vandalism policy, you did violate the Consensus policy. Your content also violates the No original research policy. You also may have violated the Edit warring policy. I'd prefer not to go to the administrators over this, because all this can be resolved if we come to an agreement about the content on the article talk page.

And remember, just as you are free to edit a page, so are other editors free to revise the content you add, to better fit it into the existing article. Wikipedia is a collaborative project. When there are disputes, we go to the talk page and work it out. But persistently adding the same thing, without first participating in discussion, frustrates our attempts at collaboration (again, see WP:BRD). Ibadibam (talk) 23:54, 17 August 2016 (UTC)

References

[1]
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia

A barnstar for you!

Edits to "Jim Radford"

Please join us for our Cascadia Wikimedians annual meeting, Saturday, December 17, 2pm

Changing my talkpage.

Edit warring;. disruptive tagging

You have no position at South Beach Diet. Ancamff's stance on that content has been repudiated by every single person who has reviewed that content and ref. Except Ammccaff who has been disruptive and is on the edge of a topic ban.

If you have a position on the content, please state it at the Talk page. Tagging and running is WP:DISRUPTIVE.

Your recent editing history at South Beach Diet shows that you are currently engaged in an edit war. To resolve the content dispute, please do not revert or change the edits of others when you are reverted. Instead of reverting, please use the talk page to work toward making a version that represents consensus among editors. The best practice at this stage is to discuss, not edit-war. See BRD for how this is done. If discussions reach an impasse, you can then post a request for help at a relevant noticeboard or seek dispute resolution. In some cases, you may wish to request temporary page protection.

Being involved in an edit war can result in your being blocked from editing—especially if you violate the three-revert rule, which states that an editor must not perform more than three reverts on a single page within a 24-hour period. Undoing another editor's work—whether in whole or in part, whether involving the same or different material each time—counts as a revert. Also keep in mind that while violating the three-revert rule often leads to a block, you can still be blocked for edit warring—even if you don't violate the three-revert rule—should your behavior indicate that you intend to continue reverting repeatedly. Jytdog (talk) 01:11, 5 January 2017 (UTC)

That I'm not participating in the dispute doesn't mean I can't document the fact that it is taking place. That's not disruptive; it's informative. Please let the tag stand until the dispute is resolved. Please also see my note to you at User talk:Jytdog#Removing maintenance templates. Ibadibam (talk) 01:15, 5 January 2017 (UTC)

If you are not involved in the dispute then I recommend you leave it alone. There is no valid content dispute; there is only disruptive behavior on the part of Ammcalf, and now by you. Ammcaff's position has precisely zero support. None. Again if you believe there is actually a valid content dispute, please state your position at the article talk page. Jytdog (talk) 01:16, 5 January 2017 (UTC)

I'll grant that Ammcalf is being disruptive, but that doesn't give you license to take out your frustration on a bystander like myself. Like I said, I'm not your enemy here. Ibadibam (talk) 01:20, 5 January 2017 (UTC)

You chose to involve yourself and to treat this like a content issue, which it is not. This is a long standing behavior issue, which is why this is at ANI, and why experienced editors there are !voting for a TBAN. Claiming that it is a content dispute, is taking a stance (one that is not defensible, at that). You are not a "bystander". Jytdog (talk) 01:35, 5 January 2017 (UTC)

Disruptive Editing?

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Recreating an article formerly deleted

Hello again! I have a few questions regarding Wikipedia policy. First of all, an article solely written on the character Annabeth Chase was nominated for deletion and merged with the main article of the book series to which she belongs. This took place in 2011. Since then, she has been featured in approximately 10 more books, a movie, and a musical. In my opinion, the article was wrongfully deleted in the first place. She a main character in several best selling books and two feature films, and is recognized by children worldwide. Surely the new works that include her push her into qualification for notability, even if she fell short before. Before created a personal article for her, I wanted to double check to make sure it was within policy. I wish to create a new article solely for the character Annabeth Chase. This is contingent on me finding enough credible sources. Thank you!Cannady212 (talk) 01:47, 20 December 2017 (UTC)

Hmm...I actually found four deletion discussions for this topic, which I've cataloged at the top of Talk:Annabeth Chase. Generally, anytime a discussion produces a consensus about an article, it takes a new discussion to form a fresh consensus for a new direction. That's especially true here, because Annabeth Chase has been locked to prevent re-creation, and if you tried to submit an edit request or deletion review it would probably get denied.

It seems to me that in the earlier years of Wikipedia, there were a lot of articles about fictional topics. And as more and more other websites popped up covering fiction (like Wikia, for example), the community here tried to refocus on real-world topics. Relevant is the policy WP:NOTPLOT, which instructs us that articles about fiction must contain more than just a summary of what happened in the story, and the general notability guideline (GNG), which says that most topics deserving of a Wikipedia article have significant, independent coverage—in this case, something beyond just being in Riordan's books and their adaptations. There are also essays covering the notability of fiction topics at Wikipedia:Notability (fiction) and Wikipedia:Notability (fictional characters). These are non-binding and are not official Wikipedia policies or guidelines, but have some useful advice.

I you feel up to it, create a draft at Draft:Annabeth Chase or User:Cannady212/Annabeth Chase, then use articles for creation or start a split discussion at Talk:List of characters in mythology novels by Rick Riordan. The draft would need to address the issues I mentioned above: it should have citations to articles, reviews or books about Riordan's works, especially pieces of literary criticism that examine this particular character. If you can find information about Riordan's process of creating and developing the character (such as what's at Percy Jackson#Creation and conception) and the process of adapting the character for other media (I think there was a section like this in one of the deleted versions of the Annabeth Chase article). Alternatively, you might be able to go straight to a split discussion, without a draft, if you just submit a list of two or three new sources that would help prove the topic's notability.

Above all, we should answer the question, what would having a standalone article for this character let us do, that we can't do when the character is part of a list. Ibadibam (talk) 05:36, 21 December 2017 (UTC)

Thank you for this information. It was very helpful in giving me some direction for this project. I will jump right in to creating a draft and then submitting it under articles for creation, as you specified. Cannady212 (talk) 17:19, 21 December 2017 (UTC)

Anytime! Ibadibam (talk) 20:14, 21 December 2017 (UTC)

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Art+Feminism, Jacob Lawrence Gallery, Saturday, May 12th, 1-5pm

For more info see
the meetup page
for Art+Feminism.

Wikipedia is one of the most wide-reaching repositories of shared knowledge, yet a 2011 survey found that less than 10% of its contributors identify as female, suggesting an alarming absence of voices. What and how information is shared is skewed by this gender disparity. To help change this, the Jacob Lawrence Gallery is organizing a quarterly series of Edit-a-thons to improve Wikipedia's coverage of womxn artists of color.

This Saturday afternoon's gathering will focus on creating, editing, updating, and expanding pages for womxn artists from Latin America and the Caribbean. The Edit-a-thon will feature a talk by Dan Paz, Lecturer in the UW School of Art + Art History + Design, an artist, and an educator who explores the labor of digital imaging production as a collaborative site where the intersections of the image-idea and lived experience are produced and contested. Through videos, photography, and sculptural projects that query the ability of documentary processes to be manipulated—to be multiplied and replicated, stopped and started, rewound and advanced—Dan works within the impossibilities of absolute replication to question the very ability of the image to truly represent.

Everyone is welcome. Access to UW WiFi will be provided for non-UW affiliated participants. All you need to bring is your laptop, power cord, and ideas. No previous Wikipedia experience required! Childcare, snacks from local businesses, and editing tutorials will be provided. Please check the Facebook event page for updates.

When: Saturday, May 12th, 1-5pm
Where: Jacob Lawrence Gallery, Art Building #132, 1915 NE Chelan Ln, Seattle, Washington 98105
Who: Everyone is welcome.
What to bring: A laptop and power cord. Access to UW WiFi will be provided for non-UW affliated participants.

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Wikipedia Day 2019 — curating images from Asahel Curtis and older Seattle photos

Women’s History Wikithon, Washington State History Museum, Saturday 3/9

Bad call

Your edits on Jewish religious cloting were both bad calls. 1. Because the consensus is clear, and has been so from the beginning, which was when this picture was added. Ergo, the burden of proof is on those who want to add it, and they have never met that burden. 2. The guy is a Chabadnick, which is clear from his style and kippah. Fact. Debresser (talk) 17:55, 23 March 2019 (UTC)

Regarding the image caption...I wish I had earlier bothered to visit your userpage where your userboxes indicate beyond doubt that you know what you're talking about when it comes to identifying Chabadniks, far more than I. As it stands now that identification depends entirely on OR, so lets try to make things more understandable for the average reader. As a starting point, would you be so good as to add some contextualizing information to the description on the image page itself—maybe explain the elements of his style and kippah—so that a non-expert reader would understand how his clothing indicates he is with Chabad? I think also it would be great to eventually expand Jewish religious clothing to explain the sartorial differences between communities. You would be indispensable to such an effort! And based on recent edits I would also ask Sir Joseph for similar help.

As to your other point, the image in question has actually been a stable part of the article for over a year (occasional vandalism notwithstanding). Since we usually favor the status quo until a new consensus is formed, and since the preexisting weak consensus supports including the image, it will remain in the article until the current discussion is resolved. Ibadibam (talk) 03:49, 24 March 2019 (UTC)

I think you should remove my name from your rfc comment. I didn't comment on any orthodox, reform or conservative movement at all, you are misinterpreting my comments.Sir Joseph ^(talk) 05:32, 24 March 2019 (UTC)

I am so, so sorry. I confused another comment for one of yours. I am striking your name from my comment. Ibadibam (talk) 05:45, 24 March 2019 (UTC)

As a matter of fact, I see no great benefit in specifying that this man is Chabad and not just Haredi. The attire is basically the same. By the way, that picture was removed from the article. Debresser (talk) 09:15, 24 March 2019 (UTC)

Well, that's RfC for you. More people get involved and the article starts changing rapidly! Ibadibam (talk) 03:11, 25 March 2019 (UTC) Also I've gone ahead and Diff of File:Man wearing tallit katan.jpg based on Sir Joseph's edit summary. If either of you see any errors in what I wrote please do correct them. Ibadibam (talk) 03:29, 25 March 2019 (UTC)

Come document women's history in Washington state!	Women’s History Wikithon When: Saturday, March 9, 10:00am-4:00pm PST Where: Washington State History Museum, 1911 Pacific Avenue, Tacoma, WA 98402 47°14′42″N 122°26′10″W Register in advance here: https://webformsrig02bo3.blackbaudhosting.com/49882/Womens-Suffrage-Centennial-Program GLAM page: Wikipedia:GLAM/Washington State Historical Society Check for updates: Wikipedia:Meetup/Seattle#Women’s History Wikithon	Washington State History Museum in Tacoma, WA
FREE. Please register in advance. Includes museum admission and snacks; please bring a sack lunch plus a laptop. Scholars and interested citizens are invited to come together for an afternoon of collaboration to create or improve Wikipedia pages related to Washington State’s suffrage history. Learn from seasoned “Wikipedians” how to edit wiki pages, and work in small groups with women’s history experts. Honor Women’s History Month by updating our reference materials to reflect the dedicated work of Washington’s women suffragists. Bring a brown bag lunch, we’ll provide snacks. Hosted by Washington State Historical Society. Women's Suffrage Centennial Program, Washington State Historical Society -> Events & Programs

	There are a couple of events this month that we hope are of interest to you.
	Tuesday, March 12 2024 3pm – 7pm (PDT), Seattle articles edit-a-thon, Seattle Public Library University Branch
	This edit-a-thon is based on importance or popularity (as determined by pageviews, see Wikipedia:WikiProject Seattle/Popular pages; or main articles, such as those linked in Template:Seattle; also see Wikipedia:Version 1.0 Editorial Team/Seattle articles by quality statistics).
	Tuesday March 19 2024 6pm – 8pm (PDT), March monthly meetup, Little Oddfellows Café—new location!!!
	Since our previous meeting place, Distant Worlds Café, now closes at 6:30pm, we will meet this month at Little Oddfellows café inside of Elliott Bay Book Company in Capitol Hill.

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	Thanks for your tips regarding minor edits and such. Padder333 (talk) 15:05, 16 September 2016 (UTC)

Seattle Wikimedia meetup \| 16 January 2024
What: Meetup to chat about Wikipedia and schedule an edit-a-thon When: Tuesday 16 January 2024, 5:45–7:45 pm Where: Distant Worlds Coffeehouse at 6401 Roosevelt Way NE, Seattle Please come! We'd love to see you.
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2024 Seattle Wiknic \| 11 August 2024
What: Picnic to eat food and chat with other Wikimedians When: Sunday 11 August 2024, noon–3 pm Where: picnic tables in the meadow area at Washington Park Arboretum Please come and bring food! We'd love to see you.
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Seattle Wikipedia Day, Saturday, January 17, from 1:00–5:00pm PT at the Capitol Hill Meeting Room at Capitol Hill Branch Library (425 Harvard Ave. E., Seattle, WA 98102) Wikipedia Day celebrates the anniversary of the founding of Wikipedia. This year we will observe Wikipedia Day with an edit-a-thon to improve the Seattle and other articles important to WikiProject Seattle, such as Architecture of Seattle, Education in Seattle, History of Seattle, Seattle metropolitan area, and Transportation in Seattle. *→Sign up at Event:Meetup/Seattle/Wikipedia 25 – Wikipedia Day 2026!←*
	Please remember to check our Seattle meetup schedule each month for upcoming events.

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